Talk:Scratch - Revision history

Knockwood: Reverted edits by 201.155.102.64 (talk) to last revision by BFGalbraith

2011-06-30T08:17:25Z

Reverted edits by 201.155.102.64 (talk) to last revision by BFGalbraith

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:17, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	This makes ~~everytnhig so completely painless~~.		==Toughness is Overpowered==
			As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be a tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.

			Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

			So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?

			We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

			====Bug to Feature====

			Context could play a big part here, because this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text could be added to TDW to explain:
			:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it is appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.
			If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.

			====Real Solution====

			What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

			:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.

			:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?

			::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)

			:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

			:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.

			:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.

			==more realistic healing options==

			Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

			games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)

			hardcore

			*HP never goes up during combat
			**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
			**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
			*healing still used in combat with death rules?
			**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
			***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
			****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
			****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

			milder

			*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
			*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

			healing between battles

			*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
			*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
			*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

			healing skills

			*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
			*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
			*toughness skills that help you be healed?

			==optional death rules==

			realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability.

201.155.102.64: MmCXyHaztKhwklA

2011-06-30T07:54:57Z

MmCXyHaztKhwklA

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:54, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	~~==Toughness is Overpowered==~~		This makes everytnhig so completely painless.
	~~As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be a tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.~~

	Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

	~~So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?~~

	We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

	~~====Bug to Feature====~~

	Context could play a big part here, because this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text could be added to TDW to explain:
	:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it is appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.
	~~If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.~~

	~~====Real Solution====~~

	What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

	:This ~~would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.~~

	~~:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?~~

	~~::"Yes"~~ makes ~~more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)~~

	:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

	~~:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.~~

	~~:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.~~

	~~==more realistic healing options==~~

	Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

	~~games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)~~

	~~hardcore~~

	*HP never goes up during combat
	**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
	**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
	*healing still used in combat with death rules?
	**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
	***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
	****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
	****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

	~~milder~~

	*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
	*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

	~~healing between battles~~

	*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
	*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
	*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

	~~healing skills~~

	*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
	*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
	*toughness skills that help you be healed?

	~~==optional death rules==~~

	~~realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability~~.

BFGalbraith: untrolling

2011-06-30T07:50:16Z

untrolling

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:50, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	What a ~~great rseoucre~~ this ~~text~~ is.		==Toughness is Overpowered==
			As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be a tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.

			Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

			So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?

			We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

			====Bug to Feature====

			Context could play a big part here, because this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text could be added to TDW to explain:
			:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it is appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.
			If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.

			====Real Solution====

			What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

			:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.

			:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?

			::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)

			:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

			:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.

			:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.

			==more realistic healing options==

			Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

			games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)

			hardcore

			*HP never goes up during combat
			**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
			**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
			*healing still used in combat with death rules?
			**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
			***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
			****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
			****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

			milder

			*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
			*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

			healing between battles

			*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
			*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
			*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

			healing skills

			*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
			*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
			*toughness skills that help you be healed?

			==optional death rules==

			realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability.

190.210.101.137: yHOIcDvPBbzgy

2011-06-30T06:30:34Z

yHOIcDvPBbzgy

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:30, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	~~==Toughness is Overpowered==~~		What a great rseoucre this text is.
	~~As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be~~ a ~~tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.~~

	Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

	~~So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?~~

	We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

	~~====Bug to Feature====~~

	~~Context could play a big part here, because~~ this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text ~~could be added to TDW to explain:~~
	~~:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it~~ is ~~appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.~~
	~~If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.~~

	~~====Real Solution====~~

	What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

	~~:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.~~

	~~:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?~~

	~~::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)~~

	:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

	~~:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.~~

	~~:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.~~

	~~==more realistic healing options==~~

	Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

	~~games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)~~

	~~hardcore~~

	*HP never goes up during combat
	**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
	**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
	*healing still used in combat with death rules?
	**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
	***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
	****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
	****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

	~~milder~~

	*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
	*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

	~~healing between battles~~

	*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
	*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
	*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

	~~healing skills~~

	*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
	*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
	*toughness skills that help you be healed?

	~~==optional death rules==~~

	~~realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability~~.

GORT: Reverted edits by 217.41.51.133 (talk) to last revision by Knockwood

2011-06-30T04:28:32Z

Reverted edits by 217.41.51.133 (talk) to last revision by Knockwood

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:28, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	~~Thank God! Someone~~ with ~~brains spkeas!~~		==Toughness is Overpowered==
			As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be a tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.

			Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

			So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?

			We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

			====Bug to Feature====

			Context could play a big part here, because this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text could be added to TDW to explain:
			:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it is appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.
			If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.

			====Real Solution====

			What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

			:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.

			:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?

			::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)

			:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

			:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.

			:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.

			==more realistic healing options==

			Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

			games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)

			hardcore

			*HP never goes up during combat
			**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
			**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
			*healing still used in combat with death rules?
			**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
			***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
			****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
			****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

			milder

			*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
			*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

			healing between battles

			*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
			*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
			*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

			healing skills

			*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
			*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
			*toughness skills that help you be healed?

			==optional death rules==

			realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability.

217.41.51.133: YLrsEanP

2011-06-30T04:17:40Z

YLrsEanP

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:17, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	~~==Toughness is Overpowered==~~		Thank God! Someone with brains spkeas!
	~~As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be a tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.~~

	Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

	~~So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy~~ with ~~4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?~~

	We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

	~~====Bug to Feature====~~

	Context could play a big part here, because this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text could be added to TDW to explain:
	:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it is appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.
	~~If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.~~

	~~====Real Solution====~~

	What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

	~~:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.~~

	~~:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?~~

	~~::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)~~

	:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

	~~:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.~~

	~~:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.~~

	~~==more realistic healing options==~~

	Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

	~~games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)~~

	~~hardcore~~

	*HP never goes up during combat
	**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
	**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
	*healing still used in combat with death rules?
	**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
	***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
	****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
	****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

	~~milder~~

	*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
	*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

	~~healing between battles~~

	*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
	*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
	*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

	~~healing skills~~

	*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
	*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
	*toughness skills that help you be healed?

	~~==optional death rules==~~

	~~realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability.~~

Knockwood: Reverted edits by 220.255.2.131 (talk) to last revision by Knockwood

2011-06-30T03:43:45Z

Reverted edits by 220.255.2.131 (talk) to last revision by Knockwood

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:43, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	What a ~~great resuocre~~ this ~~text~~ is.		==Toughness is Overpowered==
			As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be a tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.

			Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

			So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?

			We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

			====Bug to Feature====

			Context could play a big part here, because this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text could be added to TDW to explain:
			:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it is appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.
			If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.

			====Real Solution====

			What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

			:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.

			:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?

			::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)

			:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

			:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.

			:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.

			==more realistic healing options==

			Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

			games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)

			hardcore

			*HP never goes up during combat
			**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
			**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
			*healing still used in combat with death rules?
			**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
			***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
			****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
			****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

			milder

			*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
			*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

			healing between battles

			*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
			*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
			*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

			healing skills

			*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
			*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
			*toughness skills that help you be healed?

			==optional death rules==

			realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability.

220.255.2.131: UdyBSNxyUiUx

2011-06-30T03:30:57Z

UdyBSNxyUiUx

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:30, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	~~==Toughness is Overpowered==~~		What a great resuocre this text is.
	~~As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be~~ a ~~tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.~~

	Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

	~~So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?~~

	We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

	~~====Bug to Feature====~~

	~~Context could play a big part here, because~~ this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text ~~could be added to TDW to explain:~~
	~~:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it~~ is ~~appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.~~
	~~If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.~~

	~~====Real Solution====~~

	What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

	~~:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.~~

	~~:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?~~

	~~::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)~~

	:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

	~~:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.~~

	~~:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.~~

	~~==more realistic healing options==~~

	Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

	~~games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)~~

	~~hardcore~~

	*HP never goes up during combat
	**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
	**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
	*healing still used in combat with death rules?
	**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
	***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
	****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
	****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

	~~milder~~

	*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
	*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

	~~healing between battles~~

	*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
	*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
	*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

	~~healing skills~~

	*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
	*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
	*toughness skills that help you be healed?

	~~==optional death rules==~~

	~~realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability~~.

Knockwood: Reverted edits by 114.142.147.23 (talk) to last revision by Knockwood

2011-06-30T01:23:05Z

Reverted edits by 114.142.147.23 (talk) to last revision by Knockwood

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:23, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	~~Geez~~, that'~~s unbeleivlabe~~. ~~Kudos~~ and ~~such~~.		==Toughness is Overpowered==
			As the Scratch system has evolved, hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be a tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.

			Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

			So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?

			We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

			====Bug to Feature====

			Context could play a big part here, because this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future that uses Scratch without skills. ''In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text could be added to TDW to explain:
			:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it is appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.
			If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch.

			====Real Solution====

			What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

			:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.

			:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?

			::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)

			:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

			:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.

			:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.

			==more realistic healing options==

			Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

			games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)

			hardcore

			*HP never goes up during combat
			**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
			**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
			*healing still used in combat with death rules?
			**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
			***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
			****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
			****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

			milder

			*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
			*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

			healing between battles

			*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
			*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
			*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

			healing skills

			*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
			*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
			*toughness skills that help you be healed?

			==optional death rules==

			realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension and character expendability.

114.142.147.23: NjZUNspfqnT

2011-06-30T00:49:37Z

NjZUNspfqnT

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:49, 30 June 2011
Line 1:		Line 1:
	~~==Toughness is Overpowered==~~		Geez, that's unbeleivlabe. Kudos and such.
	~~As the Scratch system has evolved~~, ~~hit points have gradually increased relative to the damage of attack abilities, so everybody wants to be a tank because hit points guarantee you will last longer.~~

	Currently our official average hit points are about right (3 for an unarmored average person, 4 or 5 for a "squishy" PC, 6 or more for a tank) and the power of our attack abilities is about right (some people say they are too powerful, some say they have been nerfed, so that suggests we have hit the sweet spot.)

	~~So how do we tweak the incentives so that squishy characters will be happy with 4 or 5 hit points, but tanks will still want to have lots of hit points?~~

	We already have the engage action, which helps tanks absorb damage by drawing aggro. In playtesting, healers are more likely to be targeted by holds than high-damage attacks, so wrestling (to increase strength) might actually be better for healers than lots of toughness. Healers and long-range attackers can also take cover.

	~~====Bug to Feature====~~

	~~Context could play a big part here, because this problem is likely to be fixed by the skill system intended for Squawk 2nd Ed. TDW might be the last game in the foreseeable future~~ that ~~uses Scratch without skills. '~~'~~In TDW, there is a really good narrative to why PCs should gain toughness more often than other abilities'', which the following text could be added to TDW to explain:~~
	:Essence often warps Sorcerers into more powerful forms, increasing their size, natural armor, or other physical alterations that make them more physically resilient. Therefore, it is appropriate for Sorcerers to use essence to gain Toughness more often than other abilities.
	~~If we go with this option, this Toughness balance issue can be tabled until we are using skills in Scratch~~.

	~~====Real Solution====~~

	What if we had a rule for all injured or incapacitated characters (including minions) that between encounters they only heal to barely-healthy, unless they can make a detection, craftsmanship or healing roll to regenerate themselves to full HP?

	~~:This would decrease the guarantee that hit points make you last longer, which would be good.~~

	~~:Can you use your roll to heal an ally instead of yourself?~~

	~~::"Yes" makes more narrative sense IMHO. --[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 10:17, 25 June 2011 (PDT)~~

	:This should be the rule for a "normal" encounter cycle. Depending on the game this could mean a short rest, a month or a year of rehabilitation. Within each game there may be some back-to-back encounters without the opportunity to heal, and there may be longer breaks or full healing services at some points in a long campaign (i.e. "return to town".)

	~~:The normal encounter cycle should also be the cycle for changing craftsmanship bonuses.~~

	~~:You should not be able to respec minions in the normal encounter cycle. You need a longer break ("return to town") to replace, modify or retrain your minions.~~

	~~==more realistic healing options==~~

	Note: the three main scratch projects right now (TDW, HoW, Squawk 2nd Ed.) are fantasy/sci-fi with lots of explanations for "unrealistic healing." IMHO this rule may be decided on in the not-near future.--[[User:BFGalbraith\|BFGalbraith]] 14:31, 20 June 2011 (PDT)

	~~games without healing ability (dinosaurs and prehistoric animals)~~

	~~hardcore~~

	*HP never goes up during combat
	**damage always represents injuries that take a long time to heal.
	**It never represents physical or psychic pain, suffocation or stunning effects that people can recover from during combat. (This could make the rule incompatible with some settings or other optional rules like skills.)
	*healing still used in combat with death rules?
	**does first aid remove the healer from combat?
	***NO, either you can use healing as a combat action or you don't use healing until hostilities stop. This is all about how you interpret the duration of combat.
	****If you insist on a very quick flow of combat without pauses for maneuvering and orientation (combat takes seconds), then there is not time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies, and it is not necessary or even appropriate to treat injured allies during combat.
	****If combat turns are more like camera shots in an action movie and clashes in a real fight, which are interrupted by pauses and maneuvers that vary in duration (combat takes minutes), there is time in a battle to treat multiple injured allies or treat an ally and then return fire at an enemy.

	~~milder~~

	*you can only be healed from being incapacitated once per battle. We could give this state a name, like convalescent or wounded.
	*we could also limit each healer to healing one character form injured to healthy once per battle.

	~~healing between battles~~

	*everybody heals to stamina + 1 between battles (balance and stability - game designers know you will have most of your HP when you enter a battle.)
	*make toughness roll to heal yourself to full HP
	*make healing roll for each ally to heal them to full HP

	~~healing skills~~

	*special healing skills might be able to heal you when normal healing actions cannot.
	*special toughness skills might allow you to be healed more often.
	*toughness skills that help you be healed?

	~~==optional death rules==~~

	~~realistic or brutal games like [[Resilience]] might have death rules that add dramatic tension~~ and ~~character expendability~~.