Talk:Mano a Mano

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MaM 2007

Structure of Combat Rounds

Each character has one turn per two-second round and one or more actions per turn. Each character recovers from stun damage and recalculates damage penalties at the end of their turn. A character may have several chances to use their actions between the end of one turn and the end of their next turn, so the character's turn is the last chance to use the actions the character hasn't already used moving in formation or interfering with other characters' actions.

Choosing Actions, Formation, Interfering and Blocking Interference

At the beginning of an action the character whose turn it is, and any characters moving in formation with that character, can perform one action each. If they do not perform an action, the turn ends. Otherwise, the opposition has a chance to interfere with them by performing one action each. Then, any characters who have not performed an action but are blocking for, providing covering fire for or defending the character whose turn it is or the characters moving in formation can perform one action to interfere with the opposition.

Formation actions have to be planned before the turn begins. Interfering is an opportunity, not an invitation: The game doesn't stop so everyone can be asked if they would like to interfere. Characters interfering with interfering actions should announce their general intent in advance - "I'm covering Jimmy" - but don't have to choose a specific action or target until the opposition has chosen their interfering actions.

Speed

Speed is the maximum number of "normal" actions you can do per round. Typically, small creatures have more speed and large creatures have less. Speed is a little different from agility. Encumbrance reduces speed instead of affecting combat rolls. Speed emphasizes strength and energy and agility emphasizes coordination and reflexes, but the main difference is that agility affects the success of actions while speed affects how fast actions can be executed in series.

Actions are similar to hit points in MaM 2006 except that damage is not dealt directly to actions. Damage penalty reduces actions to less than your speed (i.e. "Hurt" actions pool). Damage penalty only has to be recalculated at the end of the character's turn.

Characters get an extra action when they use a secondary weapon. (They cannot move with this action.) Some actions take more time, keeping you busy for one or more rounds. Speed does not help with these actions. Some actions use more energy and count as two actions.

Can individuals of a given template have a different speed?

How should weapon size affect speed and actions?

Action List

Attack

A normal attack counts as one action. A normal attack can be a strike with a hand weapon or natural weapon, throwing a weapon or firing a bow or gun.

Powerful Attack

A more powerful hand to hand attack counts as two actions and has a +3 damage modifier. A couple of normal attacks has a better chance of hitting at least once, but a more powerful attack does damage quickly and hurts larger and armored characters more easily.

Defend

A character can defend to interfere with an attack against their self. This action uses the character's passive defense bonus and gives the character a +2 bonus to passive defense until the end of the character's turn. This action can only be used once per turn. (The bonus lasts until the end of the turn, so it does not need to be used more than once.)

Move

A character can move with any action, but they can also move as an action by itself.

Other Actions

Quick actions, such as pushing a door closed, count as one action. Slower actions that are not attacks could count as more actions or take a fixed amount of time.

Grappling Actions

Push

Disarm

Hold

Choke

Wrench

Throw

Archery and Marksmanship

Drawing a Bow

Keeping a Bow Drawn

Drawing a Crossbow

Firearm Actions

Stance and Posture

Crouching or Sitting

Crouching or sitting from a lying or standing position is one action. While a character is crouching or sitting they move more slowly (-1 movement, -1 to all hand to hand combat rolls except for grappling) but they are harder to hit with missile weapons (+1 to avoid a missile weapon, even without cover, unless the attack comes from above.)

Lying Down

Lying down from standing, crouching or sitting is one action. While a character is lying down they move much more slowly (-2 movement, -2 to all hand to hand combat rolls except for grappling) but they are much harder to hit with missile weapons (+2 to avoid a missile weapon, even without cover, unless the attack comes from above.)

Standing Up

Standing up from a crouching or sitting position is one action.

Instant Stand

Standing up quickly from a lying down position counts as two actions and requires an acrobatic success roll. If the roll fails the character is still lying down. If the roll is only half-successful the character is left in a crouching or sitting position.

Damage

Total Damage

Total damage = lasting damage + stun damage

Health

Health = 1 + the character's two highest athletic ability modifiers. Health is the maximum total damage a character can take without being incapacitated and falling down

Toughness

Toughness = health / speed (rounded up). Toughness is the amount of total damage required to reduce a character's actions by one. The weapon breaking rules should be removed because we don't use them, and this would make the term "toughness" less ambiguous.

Damage Penalty

Damage penalty = total damage / toughness (rounded down). Damage penalty reduces a character's actions. Because damage penalty is a fraction of your total damage, a character can take more total damage than in MaM 2006, which allows us to have weaker attacks inflict small amounts of damage instead of doing no damage at all.

Movement

Movement is the distance a character can move with each action. Movement times speed gives the character's maximum velocity in meters per round. One meter per round is 0.5 meters per second, 30 meters per minute, 1.8 kilometers per hour or a little over one mile per hour.

• On the ground, movement = 1 + running (ability modifier) - lame (disability modifier). If your movement is 0, you can move one meter per round with any one action, but no more. If your movement is less than 0 you cannot move a significant distance during combat.
• In water, movement = swimming (ability modifier). If movement is 0 or less, you can't move horizontally.
• In the air, movement = flying (ability modifier). If movement is 0 or less you can't fly.
• While climbing, movement = climbing (ability modifier) / 2. If movement is 0 or less you can't climb.

Optional Rule - Sprinting

Each time a character uses more than half their movement with any action, they take one point of stun damage.

Size

   Mass     Act Pow Abs Agi Examples

  < 1 g      5   0   0  10  small bug
   1-9 g     5   1   1   9  shrew, hummingbird
  10-99 g    5   2   2   8  mouse, largest insects
 100-999 g   4   4   3   7  rat
  1-9 kg     4   5   4   6  cat, fox, rabbit
 10-39 kg    3   7   5   5  dog, heaviest flying bird
 40-199 kg   3   8   6   4  human, deer, wolf
200-999 kg   3   9   7   3  cow, lion, horse, bear, moose
 1-9 tons    2  12   8   2  giraffe, hippo, rhino, elephant
10-100 tons  2  14   9   1  whales, largest dinosaurs
 > 100 tons  2  16  10   0  biggest whales

The pattern for actions is 1 fewer actions for every factor of 100 times mass, except for the largest and smallest categories (so the range is not too extreme.) Power bonus jumps up by 2 or 3 levels instead of 1 level when actions decrease, so the larger creatures still do more damage.

The size scale is only a guideline. Templates can be weaker or more powerful, faster or slower than their size would suggest. Some stats a character template needs include:

• mass and height or length, which probably won't have any CP value
• running ability if the character can move on land
• power (hand to hand damage bonus)
• agility (modifies combat bonuses)
• absorption (more than just armor, a degree of invulnerability)
• health and toughness
• actions
• carrying capacity (determines encumbrance), lifting ability, weapon useability

Representing Damage and Actions

Traditional Pools

Health counters are shared between stun and lasting damage and one health pool for each action. Action counters are shared between ready, used and hurt (damage penalty) pools, with two single-counter pools for a (ready) secondary weapon attack and (used) defense action.

 Damage                Health (by actions)             Actions
 __________ __________ _____ _____ _____ _____ _____   _________ _________ _________ 
|  Lasting |   Stun   |  1  |  2  |  3  |  4  |  5  | |  Ready  |  Used   |  Hurt   |
|          |          |     |     |     |     |     | |         |         |         |
|          |          |     |     |     |     |     | |_________|_________|_________|
|          |          |     |     |     |     |     | |   |2nd  |   |Extra
|__________|__________|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____| |___|Wpn. |___|Defense

Characters begin by filling one health pool for each action with their toughness in health counters or the remainder of their health counters if it is less than toughness. (The remainder should go in the first health pool.) Characters place their action counters in the ready pool - plus an extra action counter in their secondary weapon pool if they have any secondary weapons.

Branches and Leaves

Actions are represented by a slider and health pools are arranged in rows perpendicular to the action slider. Health pools are emptied top to bottom. Once a row is emptied, the action next to that row is "hurt" and the slider can't move back there. The last space in the action slider cannot be used unless the character uses a secondary weapon. A separate "toggle" counter keeps track of whether extra defense has been used. It is left on "Y" when the character plans to use it automatically and left on "N" when the character doesn't plan to use it.

Actions     Health
   __  ________________ 
5 |__||________________|
4 |__||________________|
3 |__||________________|
2 |__||________________|
1 |__||________________|
0 |__|
  |__|<--Secondary Weapon
               __    __
Extra Defense |__|Y |__|N
 __________  __________ 
|          ||          |
|  Lasting ||   Stun   |
|  Damage  ||  Damage  |
|__________||__________|

Calendar

Similar to branches and leaves except that there are no stun and lasting damage pools, there are only two damage counters and their position in the health area indicates your lasting damage and total damage. There are two extra spaces in the health table for the damage counters to "drain into". The width of the rows is the character's toughness. The player may need to shade in columns of the health table to indicate his character's Toughness

Actions      Health
   __   __ __ __ __ __ __ 
5 |__|-|__|__|__|__|__|__|
4 |__|-|__|__|__|__|__|__|
3 |__|-|__|__|__|__|__|__|
2 |__|-|__|__|__|__|__|__|
1 |__|-|__|__|__|__|__|__|
0 |__| |__|__|
  |__|<--Secondary Weapon
               __    __
Extra Defense |__|Y |__|N

Racetrack

Similar to calendar except the health rows are connected end-to-end and are parallel to a horizontal action slider instead of perpendicular to a vertical action slider. You could shade in the spaces to indicate your character's toughness and actions or you could draw a special racetrack to fit your character. The following generic example has lots of actions for fast characters and lots of toughness for healthy characters, but normal creatures would not use the full capacity of both (which would mean having 30 health.)

                ___________ ___________ ___________ ___________ ___________ ___
Health  ___ ___|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|
Action |___|___|___________|___________|___________|___________|___________|
        2nd  0       1           2 __    __  3           4           5
        Wpn.        Extra Defense |__|Y |__|N

No Beans System

One last run at the hill: When I originally made a proposal along the lines of "hey, if you give a gradual combat bonus deduction for each consecutive attack, you might be able to solve the problem of futile-attacks in the system" it was my intention to simplify Mano-a-Mano. Now, if you look at my character sheet above for example, the number of point-pools has doubled since I made that suggestion. Though there are various proposals above that might replace to pool system to something easier to use, I would like to revisit my original intention:

What if:

• We only roll once per round per weapon, with a maximum of 2 weapons per round? (Or alternatively, what if every character always had two actions per round - and reletive strength and size effected something other than their actions per round, like say their combat or power bonuses?)

Q: will reducing the number of attack rolls really simplify the system?

A: the point is NOT to reduce the number of attack rolls, but to relieve ourselves of the need for action counters all together.

• Attack power variation could be tied to passive defense variation. If your attacks have a +2 power bonus, you have a +1 to defend against attacks you do not actively defend against. If your attacks have a +5 power bonus, you have +0 to defend against attacks you do not actively defend against. (While we are modifying the combat bonus of the character on the fly anyhow, we could say the +2 Power attacks also give a +1 combat bonus in addition to the +1 Defense.)

• Since every character always has two actions per round, a "stride" stat could measure 1/2 the distance the character was allowed to move per round, that movement being tied to the character's actions.

• A character's toughness would be the amount of damage + stun that it would take to reduce the character to one move per round instead of two. The character would be incapacitated once damage + stealth was equal to double the character's toughness.

Total Beans:

There are still stun & damage pools.

If characters all have the same number of attacks per turn, regardless of their physical ability and tactics, we could make things even simpler by giving them ONE action per round and creating a list of actions varied enough to represent all the strategies we want (attack more opponents, do more damage, more defense, grappling, etc.) -TheSerpentLord

Yes, very good. The only problem I see with this is it could be tricky to figure out what the effect of using more than one weapon per round would be. I would also add that we pretty much need to have this list of varied actions just to get the two-move-per turn variation working properly. Also, I concede that one move per round would be better if we could figure out how to get one move to use two weapons. (In other words, how do we get one move to use two weapons to attack a group of two opponents?) -BFGalbraith

We may have to give up some details, so lets ask first, what is most important about using multiple weapons? I don't think it is the number of opponents you can attack. Hitting multiple opponents is possible with one weapon, and even with a single attack given the right weapon. One advantage I have seen first hand is the extra chance to parry in an attack combo, increasing the chance of hitting (represented in the con frijoles (with beans) system above by multiple normal attacks.) The extra weapon might also increase the damage you can do, but perhaps not as much as your primary weapon. The extra weapon could be represented by a separate attack roll that is not a separate action. The extra weapon might use a different attack strategy from the normal attack. -TheSerpentLord

Sistema Sin Frijoles

This system is mostly compatible with the normal "with beans" rules above, but it is less detailed. On their turn - and only on their turn - each character can move (speed * movement) meters and do one - and only one - of the following actions:

• single attack is one normal attack. This is the lowest-common-denominator action, not something you want to do if you can help it.
• powerful attack is a single attack with a +5 damage bonus. A powerful attack may sometimes represent more than one actual strike.
• combo is multiple normal attacks against a single target on your turn, giving you a better chance to hit, and potentially more damage. The number of attacks in your combo is the number of actions you would have in the con frijoles system.
• split attack - you can hit multiple targets with one normal attack each. The maximum number of targets you can hit is your speed.
• counterattack has no immediate effect, but until your next turn you can do one normal attack to every character within reach who attacks you. This might be limited by speed, suggesting beans if you don't have as much speed as you have opponents, but there's no damage penalty or normal vs. powerful attacks to worry about.
• covering another character is similar to counterattack, except that you choose an ally to defend, and you can interfere defensively with attacks even if you don't have the reach to counterattack. Because this is an aggressive type of defense, you will be hurt by a weapon that cannot be parried when you successfully defend your ally ("taking a bullet".)
• defense is similar to a single attack, but this hit-and-run/fancy-footwork strategy increases your passive defense by +2 until your next turn.
• move by itself is similar to defense except that you don't bother to attack.
• grappling actions would be mostly the same (more damage per grappling attack?)
• other actions

Quick Action

You may do one quick action, like closing a door, on your turn in addition to your regular action. Quick actions can also be done as an "other action", so you could close two doors, but then you would not be able to attack. A secondary weapon attack, crouching/sitting, lying down, sitting up and standing up (from a sit/crouch) are all quick actions. Instant stand is quick action but requires an acrobatic roll. (On the other hand, standing up carefully from lying down would be one of those "other actions" that uses your whole turn.)

Archery and Marksmanship

Archery and marksmanship actions would be quick actions or full round actions. Sequential actions might be combined to make it simpler.

Moving in Formation

To move in formation, characters may delay their turns until they are sequential.

Damage Penalty

When a character's total damage is greater than half of their health, the only kind of attack they can do is a single attack and the distance they move per turn is halved.

Me gusta!!! I would be sorely tempted to playtest the above system... I wonder if it can be merged to one of the above systems (perhaps modified to not have action counters) into a comprehensive ruleset? -BFGalbraith

Virtues

What constitutes a positive virtue of an RPG system depends on the environment in which MaM is used:

Paper & Pencil RPG / Turn-Based Computer RPG

• uses verbal narrative or description (or pictures in a computer RPG)
• complete and flexible rules trump simplicity/ease of use
• multiple attacks per combat round is good
• GM dependency is OK (in a computer RPG the machine does the GM-ing)
• players should not need to know each other's stats
• dependency on combat maps is bad (except in a computer RPG where it is OK)

Board Game / miniature-or-action-figure based RPG / Computer Strategy Game

• uses strategic modeling - dependency on combat maps is fine
• simplicity/ease of use trumps completeness
• one attack per combat round is better
• players referee each other - GM dependency is bad
• players need to see each other's character sheets (except in a computer strategy game)

Action Computer Game

• simplicity/ease-of-use is not an issue (unlimited memory and calculations)
• completeness and flexibility can be less than in an RPG.
• attacks should be handled individually instead of lumped into rounds
• players should not need to see each other's character sheets
• human GM dependency is bad
• dependency on combat maps (in the game) is fine

Hack and Slash Real-Time Role-Playing System (Hack and Slash RPS)

The Hack & Slash RPS is a variation of Mano a Mano for "button-mashing" computer and video games where each individual action is affected by input (like fighting games and shooting games.) The normal Mano a Mano rules or other variations may be more suited for a real-time strategy or role-playing game.

There are no turns or rounds, except when the words "turn" and "round" refer to a 2 second time period. Characters act at the exact moment when they decide to act (or as soon as it is physically possible.) Things that take place "on the same turn" become simultaneous or sequential but within a two second period or overlap in time.

New Character Properties:

• target: the target of the character's current action
• action: the character's current action
• action time: the time the current action started
• ignore list: a list of characters who have failed to interrupt the current action
• can interrupt: whether the character's current action can be used to interrupt an action
• half success: whether the action is limited to half succcess

New Action Properties:

• interruptible period: after this time the action cannot be interrupted
• effect time: when the action's effect takes place (usually the end of the interruptible period)
• duration: time until next action can be performed

Interfering

Actions that overlap in time can interfere with each other in spite of not being exactly simultaneous. An action can be interrupted any time between it's beginning and it's effect time. Each action can only be used to attempt one interruption. A half-successful interruption limits the action's maximum success to half success. A half-successful interruption of an action that is already limited to half success has no effect.

When your action's effect time comes up, do the following for your target and all characters targeting you if the current time is within both their action's interruptible period and your action's interruptible period and either your action or their action can interrupt:

1. determine success (with a roll or pre-rolled totals for example)
2. if your action is successful and it can interrupt, your target's action is interrupted
3. if their action is successful and it can interrupt, your action is interrupted
4. if the result is half-success and your action can interrupt, your target's success is limited to half success
5. if the result is half-success if their action can interrupt, your action's success is limited to half success
6. their action can no longer interrupt
7. your action can no longer interrupt

Movement

Movement does not have to be connected to actions (which might result in halting, irregular movement that feels less responsive.) A character's maximum distance covered in two seconds should be approximately their speed multiplied by movement in meters.

Damage Penalty

The effects of damage penalty and encumbrance on actions per round and movement can be adjusted to fit the game design. Perhaps characters need to be able to move fast to flee from losing battles, or reduced actions don't feel right or fit the animation.

Damage is split into health point pools, but the number of pools depends on how many degrees of damage penalty the game is able to represent, and the size of the pools depends on how severe those penalties are. Damage penalty should represent a fraction or percentage of health damaged or not damaged. Examples:

• three degrees of damage penalty representing full health, 2/3 health and 1/3 health
• two degrees of damage penalty representing full health and nearly-wasted
• a separate damage penalty calculated for each individual health point
• one degree of damage penalty (no effect except for being incapacitated)

The effects of damage penalty can include:

Actions

• slower actions - the length of the action animation and duration are both increased
• less powerful actions - powerful attacks are replaced by less powerful attacks that have the same duration
• delays between actions - duration increases with damage penalty, and the character acts exhausted when directed to perform an action during the delay between action animations. This may cause less responsive gameplay.

Movement

• slower movement - the character moves at a slower but constant speed.
• less powerful movement - the character does not jump as far or gets pushed around by water currents
• halting movement - the character can still move fast, but not continuously, acting exhausted and stopping or moving slowly between actions. This makes sense combined with delays between actions, but may cause less responsive gameplay.

Modifiers

• less defense - the defense action may be affected depending on how it is controlled
• less success - attack modifiers can be reduced so that fewer attacks are successful (or a percentage of attacks can be changed into feints and wild swings that don't count but are still seen)
• less damage - damage can be reduced (by a modifier or percentage.)

Success Rolls

Depending on the game design, player skill may be used instead of success rolls. For example, accurately shooting a firearm might depend entirely on player aim or on the success of the attack roll. Success may depend on both: if you fail your roll the shot is randomly offset from your target. Player aim might determine whether you hit while success level is still used for armor. Accuracy could also be based on your character's combat bonuses without success rolls.

Avoid giving character's abilities that add to their CP without being useful by removing those abilities from the game, not including them as character generation options, or having the game determine them automatically. If a character's success in combat depends only on the player's skill, then the player should not be able to waste CP by developing the character's unused combat abilities.

Seperate Optional Rules Section

I am thinking that "optional rules" should have their/its own section at the end of MaM. This way it will be easy to grasp the basic system without having to consider possible optional rules. Also, advanced players interested in optional rules will be able to find them without having to sift through the entire system.

Keeping optional rules close to default rules makes it easy to update optional rules when default rules change. It reduces the amount of cross-referencing needed. It encourages a selective approach to optional rules. It also makes optional rules easier to use so we can have a range of options from simple to advanced rather than hiding them away for advanced users only. This also means our default rules can be very basic, because popular but not essential rules are right where they need to be.

But we do want the basic system to be easy to grasp without having to consider possible optional rules, and less importantly, it is nice if advanced players can find optional rules quickly. Visually seperating optional rules from default rules without removing them from the context allows the reader to decide how much attention they want to give to optional rules. It also makes them easy for advanced readers to spot. Also if the optional rules are seperate wiki pages, we can easily create an appendix summarizing the optional rules if we want. Here is just one example of how they could be visually separated:

Optional Rule Mounted Combat When the Animal Attacks When riding an animal, the animal will fight automatically if it is trained to do so. Every time the animal attacks or defends, the rider must make a roll using their riding ability to stay mounted. The difficulty of this roll is 10. Stopping the Attack To keep the animal from attacking the rider must make an animal handling success roll every time the animal is attacked, and every round that the animal's attacker is visible. The difficulty of this roll is 10 if the animal is unhurt, or 15 if the animal has stun or damage. Animals that do not Fight Animals trained to be ridden but not to fight will not attack if they are being ridden. Instead, they will try to run unless the rider makes a successful animal handling roll. This has a difficulty of 15 if the animal is unhurt, or 20 if the animal has stun or damage. Charging Instead of having the animal attack, a rider may use the animal's speed to do a charging attack. (See Action/Attacking.) Vehicles Vehicle combat is similar to mounted combat, but most vehicles will not fight or try to run from an enemy. Ramming When a driver rams a target, their driving ability modifier or the vehicle's agility - whichever is lower - is used as the attack modifier. A successful ramming attack results in an automatically successful ramming counterattack by the target against the part of the vehicle used to ram (usually the front.) Head-on and Broadside Collisions If the vehicle and target are moving in different directions (or if only the vehicle is moving) the extra charging damage caused by the speed of both the vehicle and the target is added to the damage taken by both. Rear-end and Sideswipe Collisions If the vehicle and target are moving in the same direction then the charging damage is based on the difference in the distances the vehicle and target moved in that direction since the beginning of their last turn.

I must admit I'm much more concerned that the extra rules will add to the learning curve, than I am about some need of an advanced player. (Of course specific pritings can include and exclude whatever rules they like under the liscense.) For the purposes of this site, this suggested option might be best.--BFGalbraith 2005.12.07

Special Armor Bonuses

Weapons have special bonuses based on their design. Some help you parry, others are used for grappling, and some help you hit by reaching around defenses. Armor can also be designed to have special advantages and we can reflect this with similar special bonuses:

• Padded and ablative armor (bicycle helmet) absorb more blunt trauma, explosions, etc.
• Tough, flexible armor (leather, chainmail) resists cutting (including some stabbing weapons)
• Hard/smooth/angled/springy/stretchy armor deflects peircing attacks

The ideal armor would combine kevlar (springy/stretchy/smooth with ablative padding) and chainmail (tough against cutting.) This would be reflected as a very high absorption bonus. This composite of clay and metal would be ultra-heavy, so in practise some types of armor are more specialized:

• ("Blu") extra absorption against Blunt/Bludgeoning weapons - padding, clay, foam
• ("Cut") extra absorption against Cutting (not impaling) weapons - chainmail, leather
• ("Imp") extra absorption against Impaling weapons - lamellar? kevlar (no clay backing)
• ("B/C") extra absorption against Blunt and Cutting weapons
• ("B/I") extra absorption against Blunt and Impaling weapons - kevlar (with backing)
• ("C/I") extra absorption against Cutting and Impaling weapons

Weapons with low sharpness are usually blunt/bludgeoning weapons. Weapons with high sharpness are usually cutting weapons - even if they are mainly used for stabbing. To qualify as an impaling weapon, the weapon must be specially designed with a long narrow tip. Natural weapons are often impaling weapons so they can penetrate vital organs even through bone.

(Note: if you use kevlar without the backing it still gives you an absorption bonus against impaling weapons - including bullets - but you don't get the regular absorption bonus, so it's only going to deflect the lightest grazing hits.)

Disabilities & Using Abilities During Combat

Seriously guys. Don't allow players to take disabilities for negative CP. In fact make them pay double CP for disabilities if they want to be crippled and lame and blind and deaf and missing pretty much all their limbs and sensory organs because thats pretty much what they want anyway. Players who take disabilities can bite me.

Its pretty much an established fact that lawyers can just like see waves of sound bouncing off of your face. But at what cost? What cost indeed. If you use an ability to compensate for a disability it should require the minimum effort of 1 hitpoint per round. For example -- a blind person may use a cane to collect sensory data.

At times a GM might ask players to perform an ability check during a round of combat. My opinion is that players should not add their ability bonus to the check unless they specifically have established that they are using the ability. If the check is called before the player's turn and the player stated the use of the ability before the beginning of combat. The player would be allowed to add their ability bonus. If the check is called after the player's turn then the player would not be allowed to add their ability bonus the unless they specifically spent at least 1 hit point to use the ability.

--ulrich 11:00, 2005 Jul 2 (CEST)

LOL! - A blind person might also use a cane to fight evil - which will take more than 1 hit point per round :-). Seriously, placing limits on disabilities is essential to good gaming. A good rule would be that a character should not have more than one disability unless (A) she has a sucking character template (and then those should be her only disabilities) or (B) GM's permission (or allowed by the specific game.) Another good rule (especially if you have lots of small quirky disadvantages in the game) is to allow no more than 10 (or fewer) points of disadvantages. (This is one of those optional rules so important it should not just be in an appendix.)

I'm not sure I understand everything you are trying to say about ability checks, but we do need a rule for arbitrary actions during combat, to avoid the whole "while I fight these guys, I'm searching for traps, and burying bodies" problem.--SerpLord 15:17, 8 December 2005 (CET)

Fix Cross-References

Cross references like "(See Abilities/Skills.)" need to be hyperlinked to appropriate sections. Other text can also be hyperlinked. The only cross references that should be in (See ...) format are ones that are more helpful than distracting when you read the printed rules.

New Structure for Linear Reading

Areas that (probably) need attention:

• front and back covers, title page.
• how to create a book version
• floating tables (messy when opened in OpenOffice.org)
• (See Chapter/Section.) references
• Complete System
• Game Design
  • Adventures (basic definition of an Adventure/Scenario/Campaign/Sourcebook and what goes in it.)
  • Supplies (paper, pencil, hex mats, blank forms for templates, occupations, ability and equipment lists)
  • Templates
    • (emphasize designing templates)
    • Make a Template (follow the template structure and order more closely: dimensions, abilities, armor, limbs, weapons, CP)
  • Occupations
    • Requirements (abilities, training, social class, etc.)
    • Perquisites (equipment, income, social status, etc.)
    • other limitations (minimum/maximum number of occupations, starting occupations) part of Requirements?
  • Abilities
    • Availability (some abilities are limited to certain templates)
  • Equipment (explain how to design equipment - this is not about CP!)
• Character Creation
  • placement of missing limbs information and CP
  • placement of build information and CP
  • Occupations?
  • Character Equipment
  • Make a Character - Character Generation Example (review for consistency)
• Character Development
  • Developing Abilities through Training and Experience
  • Changing Occupations
  • Inventory Management or Acquiring and Losing Equipment (see Character Equipment)
  • Making Equipment
    • Equipment CP (see Armor and Weapon CP in the Template CP rules)
    • Make an Item - Equipment Generation Example

Things BFGalbraith noticed

When I was working on the How-To-Play adventure for www.SquawkRPG.net , I found that following things probably need to be included in Mano a Mano IMHO:

Rules for varying Height and Reach for individual characters (perhaps something as simple as +1 or -1 CP for an extra 1/2 meter, with no such option for zero-reach characters?)

Character templates have minimum and maximum heights, if you are outside that range, the template does not describe you. A full 50cm reach difference seems like it would also mean you are mutated beyond your template. We should consider (at least for future editions of MaM) templates that don't allow build variation (mecha) and and templates that allow extraordinary variation (mutants.)

If we look at a sufficiently large template (an 18 meter giant for example) a 0.5 meter reach difference is only like a 5 cm difference for a human. 1 CP per 0.5 m might work. We can set the minimum for all templates at 0 (could reflect disability or damage) but how do we set maximums? The easiest solution is to only allow it if the GM approves and/or assume that templates reflect the upper limit of the race's reach. The complicated solution is to add a new number to the template (especially complicated because now templates present options with multiple CP values instead of a fixed package of features.) --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)

An explaination of "Kick" (from what I understand it's supposed to be like "pull" but you spend the hit points after firing the weapon instead of before...)

your guess is as good as mine :-) --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)

An example of how to calculate the CP of the max range of a weapon (so a decent archery example... the correct answer is "you DON'T caculate CP of the max range of a weapon," but an example of how to caculate max range is needed.) In other words, we need a clear example of pull.

The reach of a ranged weapon is it's effective range. The CP of reach is 1 CP for each 0.5 m, or 2 CP/m According to Wikipedia, an AK-47 has an effective range of 300-450 m. Depending on whether you take the high or low estimate, that's 600-900 CP. (Imagine that we are fighting on an open plain and you have an AK-47 and I have a knife. I can move a few meters every time you get a shot off, so you'll get a dozen chances to shoot me before I reach you. It's potentially like a guy with a knife fighting 20 guys with spears.)

One nice thing about MaM is that it has been created by people who have really shot bows bows and firearms, have had their arms twisted into submission, been choked out, knocked out, slowly beaten down, been cut by knives, have done full-contact stick fighting, etc. :) I think you are forgetting "kick" in the above CP formula. Kick is Pull for fire arms, and the difference is that you spend the hit points as you pull the trigger, instead of before you pull the trigger. Body-power subtracts from kick before you spend the HP (parrelled to how it effects pull.) So for a 400 meter range weapon, with a kick of 4, the actual "reach" listed on the character sheet would be 100, and the total range would be 400m (4HPx100m.) In that case the reach of the AK would be worth 50 CP, and that would be about right IMHO. (And THAT's why we need an example of Kick in the rules.) -BFGalbraith, Sept. 12, 2006

The relationship between pull and range is complex, but here's a rough formula: 120 m + (20 m for each +1 pull), but no less than 20m. --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)

I couldn't find any equipment mass calculation rules (they were probably removed when we were attempting "fuzzy size",) which is pretty important in the case of generating Armor.

Armor is way more important (players expect characters to be slowed down by heavy armor.) There are 3 main factors involved in Armor: Cover, Absorption, and Toughness. I would think that for primitive technologies, the mass of this would be something like "(Cover + Absorption + Toughness) times 20% of Carying Capacity = armor mass," and that for advanced technologies it might be something like "(Cover + Absorption + Toughness) times 10% of Carying Capacity = armor mass."

Here's an empirical approach: For midieval armor divide the mass by the cover bonus and get a "mass per Cvr" value. Then we can divide that by the weight of a large man (100 kg) and get an estimate of the weight per cover for any species (based on that species' upper weight limit.) Modern high-tech armor may be 1% better, and some vital areas of the body require less material to cover and still give a +1 bonus. (For example a titanium chest plate that covers my heart could have +1 cover and +5 absorption, but only weigh 2 or 3 kg.)

Armor Type  mass/Cvr  Abs  Tgh
Padded       1% /Cvr   1    2
Leather      2% /Cvr   2    3
Scale        4% /Cvr   3    3
Chainmail    3% /Cvr   3    3
Brigandine   5% /Cvr   4    3
Lamellar     4% /Cvr   4    4
Plate        5% /Cvr   5    4

The "ideal" formula for the armor's mass is the wearer's mass times the cover and absorption of the armor, divided by 100. Padded, Leather, Chainmail, Lamellar and Plate approach this ideal. Scale and Brigandine are a little less efficient, but they are inexpensive and just as useful in many situations. Toughness is more an economics issue (how much do I want to invest in this much armor?) --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)

We might not want hard and fast rules for weapons, but we might give a "general guidline" of five levels less than it's power bonus.

If the weapon is mace-like (maximum power, minimum mass) then it could be a whole size level lighter. If the weapon is fist-like (minimum power, maximum mass) it could be a size level heavier. In other words a 1 kg mace has at least as much impact as a 3 kg sword. There is also variation within families of weapons. A sword with a +3 power bonus is not balanced the same as a sword with a +2 power bonus. --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)

Boiler Plate for MaM "Design"

Some adventures are a sequence of challenges like an obstacle course. However, players often want to be able to try anything they want with their characters, so an engaging environment for the characters to freely adventure in - letting the story develop naturally - is usually better than forcing players to follow a story line.

For example, if the PCs are likely to end up fighting in a village market, the GM should have a village market combat map prepared. (Instead, the GM may choose to have a blank sheet of Hex Paper, and use "pieces" to show where various Village Market obstacles are on the hex paper.) The more specific the location, the more important it is for the GM to have a specific map prepared. The GM may also have a selection of general terrain maps, for conflicts that take place in general types of areas, instead of taking place in very specific locations.

You will need one piece for every important character in the game. You will also need a piece for every significant object in the game, which is not already part of a combat map. (By significant object, I mean any visible object that the players are likely to interact with. For example, if there is a discarded spear the players are supposed to find out in the open, it would be best to have a piece for that spear, if it is not part of a map.)

After studying this tutorial, these should be all the reference materials the GM and players need to play the game. Some of the pages can help players create their PCs, others are designed only for the GM's use.