Talk:Mano a Mano
Contents
- 1 Titles on Mano a Mano pages (keep this item on top)
- 2 Multiple Systems?
- 3 MaM 2007
- 4 Seperate Optional Rules Section
- 5 Special Armor Bonuses
- 6 Disabilities & Using Abilities During Combat
- 7 Fix Cross-References
- 8 New Structure for Linear Reading
- 9 Things BFGalbraith noticed
- 10 Boiler Plate for MaM "Design"
Titles on Mano a Mano pages (keep this item on top)
DON'T put chapter titles (== Chapter Title ==) on chapter pages (Introduction, Rolling Dice,Characters, Abilities, Equipment or Action Rules.) If you visit a chapter from the ToC the extra title is redundant. The chapter titles are built into the Complete System page (which is printing-oriented and does not need edit links.)
DO put section titles (=== Section Title ===) on pages that contain sections of a chapter. They are redundant if you visit the individual page, but you will usually see these pages as part of a chapter page, and being able to click on the title allows you to edit the section.
Multiple Systems?
Virtues
What constitutes a positive virtue of an RPG system depends on the environment in which MaM is used:
Paper & Pencil RPG / Turn-Based Computer RPG
- uses verbal narrative or description (or pictures in a computer RPG)
- complete and flexible rules trump simplicity/ease of use
- multiple attacks per combat round is good
- GM dependency is OK (in a computer RPG the machine does the GM-ing)
- players should not need to know each other's stats
- dependency on combat maps is bad (except in a computer RPG where it is OK)
Board Game / miniature-or-action-figure based RPG / Computer Strategy Game
- uses strategic modeling - dependency on combat maps is fine
- simplicity/ease of use trumps completeness
- one attack per combat round is better
- players referee each other - GM dependency is bad
- players need to see each other's character sheets (except in a computer strategy game)
Action Computer Game
- simplicity/ease-of-use is not an issue (unlimited memory and calculations)
- completeness and flexibility can be less than in an RPG.
- attacks should be handled individually instead of lumped into rounds
- players should not need to see each other's character sheets
- human GM dependency is bad
- dependency on combat maps (in the game) is fine
Simple and Simultaneous Turns
This is an idea for a simplifying Mano a Mano, for a less-detailed RPG or board game.
A character can move and act only on their turn. Characters make one defense roll per turn like a single passive defense action against every attack thrown at them that turn. Attack rolls and damage calculations are lumped together in a batch. All effects of damage including death and incapacitation are delayed until the end of the damaged character's turn. If I get shot dead I fall down at the end of my next turn, treating that turn as simultaneous with the turn in which I was shot.
For example, player 1 announces that his character is shooting player 2's character twice in the chest and once in the head. Player 2 rolls a die and tells player 1 the result plus his character's defense modifiers. If the defense roll is less than player 1's character's attack modifier, he tells player 2 the total damage of the three shots without having to roll. Otherwise, player 1 subtracts his attack modifier from the defense roll. If the result is greater than 6 he tells player 2 that all the shots missed without having to roll. Otherwise, player 1 rolls three dice - one for each attack. Each die that is higher than the defense roll minus attack modifiers is a hit.
Hack and Slash Real-Time Role-Playing System (Hack and Slash RPS)
This set of variations is intended for "button-mashing" computer and video games where each individual action is affected by input. The normal Mano a Mano rules may be more suited for a real-time strategy or role-playing game.
There are no turns or rounds, except when the words "turn" and "round" refer to a 2 second time period. Characters act at the exact moment when they decide to act (or as soon as it is physically possible.) Things that take place "on the same turn" become simultaneous or sequential but within a two second period or overlap in time.
Each action has a time until it takes effect (effect time) and time until the next action can begin (duration). The minimum duration of an action is two seconds multiplied by the number of action points the action requires, divided by the character's action points. Action points are calculated on the fly (whenever a character's abilities, equipment or damage penalty changes) and are not "used", but help calculate action duration.
Duration is not always the same as the length of the animation representing the action. You may be able to jump into another action before the follow-through part of the animation is finished, or you may return to standing or moving animation for a moment before you can do the next action.
Actions that overlap in time can interfere with each other in spite of not being exactly simultaneous. When your action's effect time comes up, do a success roll (or compare pre-rolled totals) for your target's action and all actions targeting you if the action can be interrupted.
An action can be interrupted any time between it's beginning and it's effect time. A character cannot try to interrupt the same action twice. An action cannot interrupt two actions by the same character. In other words, for each action keep a list of the characters who have tried and failed to interrupt the action. Actions from these characters no longer affect that action, and it does not affect actions from those characters.
- If your action is successful, it continues, but the target's action is interrupted.
- If your action fails, it is interrupted but the target's action continues.
- If the action is half successful, reduce both actions' effects to half success (but don't reduce it again if it is already half successful from a previous interfering action.)
MaM 2007
Structure of Combat Rounds
Each character has one turn per two-second round and one or more actions per turn.
At the beginning of an action the character whose turn it is, and any characters moving in formation with that character, can move and perform one action each. If they do not move or perform an action, the turn ends. Otherwise, the opposition has a chance to interfere with them by moving and performing one action each. Then, any characters who have not moved or attacked but are blocking for, providing covering fire for or defending the character whose turn it is or the characters moving in formation can move and perform one action to interfere with the opposition.
Formation actions have to be planned before the turn begins. Interfering is an opportunity, not an invitation: The game doesn't stop so everyone can be asked if they would like to interfere. Characters interfering with interfering actions should announce their general intent in advance - "I'm covering Jimmy" - but don't have to choose a specific action or target until the opposition has chosen their interfering actions.
Each character recovers from stun damage and recalculates damage penalties at the end of their turn. Action and movement limits apply to the period from the end of a character's turn until the end of their next turn. Each character has a full round to spread their actions out. A character's turn is the last chance to use the actions the character hasn't already used moving in formation or interfering with other characters' actions.
Maximum Number of Actions per Round
Maximum attacks per turn is no longer the same thing as the amount of damage you can take. Hit points are replaced by separate health, movement and actions. Characters who can take more damage may have fewer attacks per round than characters who can take less damage.
- Damage penalty reduces actions (i.e. "Hurt" actions pool)
- Damage penalty only has to be recalculated at the end of the character's turn
- Encumbrance now reduces actions instead of affecting combat rolls
- Characters get an extra action when they use a secondary weapon
- Smaller templates often have more actions than larger templates
- Is it redundant for size to give further handicaps to combat bonus (agility)?
- Can individuals of a given template have a different number of actions?
- Should weapon size reduce actions?
Limited Attack Types
In MaM 2007, the basic combat actions are simpler and different attack types have the same combat bonuses.
- A normal attack counts as one action
- A more powerful attack counts as two actions and has a +2 damage modifier.
- A couple of normal attacks has a better chance of hitting at least once, but a more powerful attack does damage quickly and hurts larger and armored characters more easily.
- A character can use a defense action to interfere with an attack. This action uses the character's passive defense bonus and gives the character a +2 bonus to passive defense until the end of the character's turn. The defense action can only be used once per turn.
- Quick actions that are not attacks, such as pushing a door closed, count as one action.
- Slower actions that are not attacks could count as more actions or take a fixed amount of time.
New Damage System
Damage penalty is a fraction of your total damage. This increases the total damage a character can take, which allows us to have weaker attacks inflict small amounts of damage instead of doing no damage at all.
- Total damage = lasting damage + stun damage
- Toughness reflects how much total damage you can take without showing any effects. The weapon breaking rules should be removed because we don't use them, and this would make the term "toughness" less ambiguous. Should toughness increase with size?
- Damage penalty = total damage / toughness. Damage penalty reduces a character's movement and action points.
- Health = maximum damage penalty * toughness. Health is the maximum total damage you can take without being incapacitated and falling down
New Movement System
Movement is based on ability modifiers and the character's damage penalty at the end of their last turn. A character can move one meter for each movement point. (One meter per round is 0.5 meters per second, 30 meters per minute, 1.8 kilometers per hour or a little over one mile per hour.) A character can move before and after each attack or counterattack, but they must be in a position where they can attack their opponent to begin the attack.
- On the ground, movement = 1 + running (ability modifier) - lame (disability modifier) - damage penalty. If your movement is 0 or less, look up the distance you can move on the following table:
| Movement | Distance you can move per round | ||
|---|---|---|---|
| 0 | 50 cm or a full one meter space every other round | ||
| -1 | 25 cm or a full one meter space every four rounds | ||
| -2 | 10 cm or a full one meter space every ten rounds | ||
| -3 or less | you cannot move (i.e 1 + 0 Running - 4 Lame) |
- In water, movement = swimming (ability modifier) - damage penalty. If movement is 0 or less, you can't move horizontally.
- In the air, movement = flying (ability modifier) - damage penalty. If movement is 0 or less you can't fly.
- While climbing, movement = (climbing (ability modifier) - damage penalty) / 2. If movement is 0 or less you can't climb.
New Size Scale
Mass Pow[1] Abs Agi Actions Examples < 1 g -5(-3) -6 +6 5 small bug 1-9 g -4(-2) -5 +5 5 shrew, hummingbird 10-99 g -3(-1) -4 +4 5 mouse, largest insects 100-999 g -2 (0) -3 +3 4 rat 1-9 kg -1(+1) -2 +2 4 cat, fox, rabbit 10-49 kg 0(+2) -1 +1 3 dog, heaviest flying bird 50-199 kg +1(+3) 0 0 3 human, deer, wolf 200-999 kg +2(+4) +1 -1 3 cow, lion, horse, bear, moose 1-9 tons +3(+5) +2 -2 2 giraffe, hippo, rhino, elephant 10-99 tons +4(+6) +3 -3 2 whales, largest dinosaurs > 100 tons +5(+7) +4 -4 2 biggest whales [1] the number in parentheses is the power of a powerful attack
The pattern for actions is 1 action for every factor of 100 times mass. So the three size levels between 10 and 1000 kg (dog, human, horse) have the same number of actions, then the next two size levels above and below them have one more or less actions. the biggest whales should have 1 action by this pattern, and small bugs should have 6 actions, but I have kept them closer to neighboring size creatures so that these exceptional creatures don't exaggerate the sense of scale.
The size scale is a guideline. Templates can be weaker or more powerful, faster or slower than their size would suggest. Some of the stats a character template needs include:
- mass and height or length, which probably won't have any CP value
- running ability if the character can move on land
- power (hand to hand damage bonus)
- agility (modifies combat bonuses)
- absorption (more than just armor, a degree of invulnerability)
- health and toughness (may be based on or affected by athletic abilities)
- actions
- carrying capacity (used to determine encumbrance, lifting ability, weapon useability)
Representing AP and Movement
Although we could use counters for movement, it will probably be more convenient to list total movement as a stat on the character sheet, and trust player/GM memory for how much movement has been used each round.
Traditional Pools
Health counters are shared between stun and lasting damage and one health pool for each damage penalty from 0 to the maximum damage penalty. Action counters are shared between ready, used and hurt (damage penalty) pools, with two single-counter pools for a (ready) secondary weapon attack and (used) defense action.
Damage Health (by damage penalty) Actions __________ __________ _______ _______ _______ _______ _________ _________ _________ | Lasting | Stun | 0 | 1 | 2 | 3 | | Ready | Used | Hurt | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |_________|_________|_________| | | | | | | | | |2nd | |Extra |__________|__________|_______|_______|_______|_______| |___|Wpn. |___|Defense
Characters would begin with all their health counters divided evenly between their different levels of damage penalty and action counters equal to their normal actions in ready - plus an extra action counter in their secondary weapon pool if they have any secondary weapons.
Branches and Leaves
Actions are represented by a slider and health pools are arranged in rows perpendicular to the action slider. The width of the rows is the characters toughness. Health pools are emptied top to bottom. Once a row is emptied, the action next to that row is "hurt" and the slider can't move back there.
Act. Health (Damage Penalty)
__ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
|__||_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_| (0)
|__||_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_| (1)
|__||_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_| (2)
|__||_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_| (3)
|__|
|__|<-- Secondary Weapon
_ _
Extra Defense |_|Y |_|N
__________ __________
| | |
| Lasting | Stun |
| Damage | Damage |
|__________|__________|
The player may need to shade in columns of the health table to indicate his character's health/toughness and spaces in the action slider to represent how many actions his character has. The last space in the action slider cannot be used unless the character uses a secondary weapon.
A separate "toggle" counter is used to keep track of whether extra defense has been used. It can be left on when the character plans to use it automatically and it can be left off when the character doesn't plan to use it.
Calendar
Similar to branches and leaves except that there are no stun and lasting damage pools, there are only two damage counters and their position in the health area indicates your lasting damage and total damage.
Racetrack
Similar to calendar except that instead of shading the block you draw two rows of blocks (the character sheet can provide faint grid lines to draw over with a pencil.) The top row of blocks is one block for each point of health. The blocks drawn on the bottom row are wider: their width is your toughness, and you have one of these wide blocks for each of your actions.
_________________________________ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Damage |_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_________ _________ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Action _ _|_________|_________|_________|_________|_________|_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
_ _
Extra Defense |_|Y |_|N
In this example the Damage row has two extra spaces at the beginning so you can start the two damage counters somewhere. As long as you move both counters for each point of lasting damage and just the right counter for each point of stun damage, the position of the right counter will give you the first not-hurt action.
Strength-Free System
Another Action system based on these lessons learned might look like this:
- Combat rolls are strictly ability + die roll (+ nothing, especially not from Action.)
- Instead of combining Health + Actions-per-round, I've combined Health + Toughness.
- 5 Health Point pools: Vital, Fresh A, Fresh B, Stunned, Damaged. The character starts with 1/3 of his health points in Vital, 1/3 in Fresh A, and the final 1/3 Fresh B. Stun & Lasting damage come out of Fresh B before Fresh A, and Fresh A before Vital. When Fresh B is empty, the character loses 1 action per round. When Fresh A is empty, the character loses an additional 1 action per round (for a total of 2 actions per round lost.) When Vital is empty the character is incapacitated.
- Actions can be used 2 ways, any of which can be accompanied by moving Stride times #-of-Actions-used in distance:
- One Action can be used to deliver a "normal" attack that would give a +2 damage.
- Two actions can be combined for a powerful attack that would give a +5 damage.
- Extra actions can be obtained one of these ways:
- Using multiple weapons in one turn can give an extra non-moving action with one of the "non-primary" weapons.
- Giving up ability bonus in passive defense can give an extra action that can be used for anything.
- This is represented by an extra Action counter always residing in the "defense" action pool unless a defense-compromising action is used.
- Action-pools let us keep track of how many actions we've used so far.
- Health is not size dependent, and might be 1 plus the ability levels of the character's two highest athletic ability levels.
- The following size chart and bonuses are used:
mass pow/abs Actions example < 99 g -4 4 Mice, insects 100-999 g -3 4 rat 1-9 kg -2 4 cat/fox/rabbit 10-49 kg -1 3 dog, heaviest flying bird 50-199 kg 0 3 human/deer/wolf 200-999 kg +1 3 cow/lion/horse/bear/moose 1-9 tons +2 2 giraffe/hippo/rhino/elephant 10-99 tons +3 2 large sauropods and whales > 100 tons +4 2 biggest whales
This chart above represents the concept I'm aiming for, though I am unsure of the balance with Actions. It would be better for actions to be TOTALLY template-based:
Actions TemplateCP 1 1 2 2 3 4 4 8 5 16 6 32
This Character Sheet may then look something like:
Name _________________________ Age ______ Sex ______Template _________________ Occupation(s) ____________________________________________ Template CP (_____) Length/Height ________ Reach _____ Stride ____ Actions____ Ability CP (_____) Mass _______ Equipment Mass _______ Encumbrance ____ Other CP (_____) Power ___ Absorption ___ Toughness ___ Health ____/3=____r___ Total CP (_____) ABILITIES/disabilities Mod Lvl (CP) Mod Lvl (CP) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) _______________________ ___ ___ (____) EQUIPMENT (item name & special modifiers) Qty Mass Abs Cvr Cmb Spd Pwr Shp Rch _________________________________________ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _________________________________________ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _________________________________________ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _________________________________________ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _________________________________________ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _________________________________________ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _________________________________________ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _________________________________________ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ Movement: |_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_|_| _____________________________________________________________________________ | Ready Actions Used Actions Hurt Actions | | Defense | 2nd Weapon | Primary | | | |_______________|______________|_______________|______________|_______________| | | | | | | | | | | | | | Vital Health |Fresh Health A|Fresh Health B |Stunned Health|Damaged Health | | | | | | | |_______________|______________|_______________|______________|_______________|
Sprinting
A character can sprint twice as fast as their normal movement (two meters per movement point.) When a character sprints they have a -2 modifier against hand to hand attacks for a full round. A sprinting character takes 2 points of stun damage every round that they sprint (even if they only sprint a short distance.)
Minimum Values
One new area being explored in MaM 2007 is minimum values to avoid situations where characters become completely useless, like minimum actions, minimum movement, minimum damage, and so on.
- "critical hit/success" is the primary way other RPG systems keep attacks from being totally stupid and void of value. "Automatically do at least one point of lasting damage when you roll a 6" could single handedly solve the pointless-attack problem in Mano a Mano 2006.
- And ONLY solve the pointless attack problem :-) There are several rules involved here: Automatic success, automatic failure, minimum damage, and critical hit/success. The rule you propose would combine automatic success and minimum damage, which is clever, but I think this is a finishing touch that - by itself - won't make an ackward off-balance/unbalanceable system into the game we want to play. -TheSerpentLord
No Beans System
One last run at the hill: When I originally made a proposal along the lines of "hey, if you give a gradual combat bonus deduction for each consecutive attack, you might be able to solve the problem of futile-attacks in the system" it was my intention to simplify Mano-a-Mano. Now, if you look at my character sheet above for example, the number of point-pools has doubled since I made that suggestion. Though there are various proposals above that might replace to pool system to something easier to use, I would like to revisit my original intention:
What if:
- We only roll once per round per weapon, with a maximum of 2 weapons per round?
- Q: will reducing the number of attack rolls really simplify the system?
- A: the point is NOT to reduce the number of attack rolls, but to relieve ourselves of the need for action counters all together.
- Attack power variation could be tied to passive defense variation. If your attacks have a +2 power bonus, you have a +1 to defend against attacks you do not actively defend against. If your attacks have a +5 power bonus, you have +0 to defend against attacks you do not actively defend against. (While we are modifying the combat bonus of the character on the fly anyhow, we could say the +2 Power attacks also give a +1 combat bonus in addition to the +1 Defense.)
- Since every character always has two actions per round, a "stride" stat could measure 1/2 the distance the character was allowed to move per round, that movement being tied to the character's actions.
- A character's toughness would be the amount of damage + stun that it would take to reduce the character to one move per round instead of two. The character would be incapacitated once damage + stealth was equal to double the character's toughness.
Total Beans:
Unfortunately, even with this system we still have enough beans for a fiesta - there are still stun & damage pools.
Seperate Optional Rules Section
I am thinking that "optional rules" should have their/its own section at the end of MaM. This way it will be easy to grasp the basic system without having to consider possible optional rules. Also, advanced players interested in optional rules will be able to find them without having to sift through the entire system.
- Keeping optional rules close to default rules makes it easy to update optional rules when default rules change. It reduces the amount of cross-referencing needed. It encourages a selective approach to optional rules. It also makes optional rules easier to use so we can have a range of options from simple to advanced rather than hiding them away for advanced users only. This also means our default rules can be very basic, because popular but not essential rules are right where they need to be.
- But we do want the basic system to be easy to grasp without having to consider possible optional rules, and less importantly, it is nice if advanced players can find optional rules quickly. Visually seperating optional rules from default rules without removing them from the context allows the reader to decide how much attention they want to give to optional rules. It also makes them easy for advanced readers to spot. Also if the optional rules are seperate wiki pages, we can easily create an appendix summarizing the optional rules if we want. Here is just one example of how they could be visually separated:
|
Optional Rule Mounted Combat
|
- I must admit I'm much more concerned that the extra rules will add to the learning curve, than I am about some need of an advanced player. (Of course specific pritings can include and exclude whatever rules they like under the liscense.) For the purposes of this site, this suggested option might be best.--BFGalbraith 2005.12.07
Special Armor Bonuses
Weapons have special bonuses based on their design. Some help you parry, others are used for grappling, and some help you hit by reaching around defenses. Armor can also be designed to have special advantages and we can reflect this with similar special bonuses:
- Padded and ablative armor (bicycle helmet) absorb more blunt trauma, explosions, etc.
- Tough, flexible armor (leather, chainmail) resists cutting (including some stabbing weapons)
- Hard/smooth/angled/springy/stretchy armor deflects peircing attacks
The ideal armor would combine kevlar (springy/stretchy/smooth with ablative padding) and chainmail (tough against cutting.) This would be reflected as a very high absorption bonus. This composite of clay and metal would be ultra-heavy, so in practise some types of armor are more specialized:
- ("Blu") extra absorption against Blunt/Bludgeoning weapons - padding, clay, foam
- ("Cut") extra absorption against Cutting (not impaling) weapons - chainmail, leather
- ("Imp") extra absorption against Impaling weapons - lamellar? kevlar (no clay backing)
- ("B/C") extra absorption against Blunt and Cutting weapons
- ("B/I") extra absorption against Blunt and Impaling weapons - kevlar (with backing)
- ("C/I") extra absorption against Cutting and Impaling weapons
Weapons with low sharpness are usually blunt/bludgeoning weapons. Weapons with high sharpness are usually cutting weapons - even if they are mainly used for stabbing. To qualify as an impaling weapon, the weapon must be specially designed with a long narrow tip. Natural weapons are often impaling weapons so they can penetrate vital organs even through bone.
(Note: if you use kevlar without the backing it still gives you an absorption bonus against impaling weapons - including bullets - but you don't get the regular absorption bonus, so it's only going to deflect the lightest grazing hits.)
Disabilities & Using Abilities During Combat
Seriously guys. Don't allow players to take disabilities for negative CP. In fact make them pay double CP for disabilities if they want to be crippled and lame and blind and deaf and missing pretty much all their limbs and sensory organs because thats pretty much what they want anyway. Players who take disabilities can bite me.
Its pretty much an established fact that lawyers can just like see waves of sound bouncing off of your face. But at what cost? What cost indeed. If you use an ability to compensate for a disability it should require the minimum effort of 1 hitpoint per round. For example -- a blind person may use a cane to collect sensory data.
At times a GM might ask players to perform an ability check during a round of combat. My opinion is that players should not add their ability bonus to the check unless they specifically have established that they are using the ability. If the check is called before the player's turn and the player stated the use of the ability before the beginning of combat. The player would be allowed to add their ability bonus. If the check is called after the player's turn then the player would not be allowed to add their ability bonus the unless they specifically spent at least 1 hit point to use the ability.
--ulrich 11:00, 2005 Jul 2 (CEST)
- LOL! - A blind person might also use a cane to fight evil - which will take more than 1 hit point per round :-). Seriously, placing limits on disabilities is essential to good gaming. A good rule would be that a character should not have more than one disability unless (A) she has a sucking character template (and then those should be her only disabilities) or (B) GM's permission (or allowed by the specific game.) Another good rule (especially if you have lots of small quirky disadvantages in the game) is to allow no more than 10 (or fewer) points of disadvantages. (This is one of those optional rules so important it should not just be in an appendix.)
- I'm not sure I understand everything you are trying to say about ability checks, but we do need a rule for arbitrary actions during combat, to avoid the whole "while I fight these guys, I'm searching for traps, and burying bodies" problem.--SerpLord 15:17, 8 December 2005 (CET)
Fix Cross-References
Cross references like "(See Abilities/Skills.)" need to be hyperlinked to appropriate sections. Other text can also be hyperlinked. The only cross references that should be in (See ...) format are ones that are more helpful than distracting when you read the printed rules.
New Structure for Linear Reading
Areas that (probably) need attention:
- front and back covers, title page.
- how to create a book version
- floating tables (messy when opened in OpenOffice.org)
- (See Chapter/Section.) references
- Complete System
- Game Design
- Adventures (basic definition of an Adventure/Scenario/Campaign/Sourcebook and what goes in it.)
- Supplies (paper, pencil, hex mats, blank forms for templates, occupations, ability and equipment lists)
- Templates
- (emphasize designing templates)
- Make a Template (follow the template structure and order more closely: dimensions, abilities, armor, limbs, weapons, CP)
- Occupations
- Requirements (abilities, training, social class, etc.)
- Perquisites (equipment, income, social status, etc.)
- other limitations (minimum/maximum number of occupations, starting occupations) part of Requirements?
- Abilities
- Availability (some abilities are limited to certain templates)
- Equipment (explain how to design equipment - this is not about CP!)
- Character Creation
- placement of missing limbs information and CP
- placement of build information and CP
- Occupations?
- Character Equipment
- Make a Character - Character Generation Example (review for consistency)
- Character Development
- Developing Abilities through Training and Experience
- Changing Occupations
- Inventory Management or Acquiring and Losing Equipment (see Character Equipment)
- Making Equipment
- Equipment CP (see Armor and Weapon CP in the Template CP rules)
- Make an Item - Equipment Generation Example
Things BFGalbraith noticed
When I was working on the How-To-Play adventure for www.SquawkRPG.net , I found that following things probably need to be included in Mano a Mano IMHO:
Rules for varying Height and Reach for individual characters (perhaps something as simple as +1 or -1 CP for an extra 1/2 meter, with no such option for zero-reach characters?)
- Character templates have minimum and maximum heights, if you are outside that range, the template does not describe you. A full 50cm reach difference seems like it would also mean you are mutated beyond your template. We should consider (at least for future editions of MaM) templates that don't allow build variation (mecha) and and templates that allow extraordinary variation (mutants.)
- If we look at a sufficiently large template (an 18 meter giant for example) a 0.5 meter reach difference is only like a 5 cm difference for a human. 1 CP per 0.5 m might work. We can set the minimum for all templates at 0 (could reflect disability or damage) but how do we set maximums? The easiest solution is to only allow it if the GM approves and/or assume that templates reflect the upper limit of the race's reach. The complicated solution is to add a new number to the template (especially complicated because now templates present options with multiple CP values instead of a fixed package of features.) --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)
An explaination of "Kick" (from what I understand it's supposed to be like "pull" but you spend the hit points after firing the weapon instead of before...)
- your guess is as good as mine :-) --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)
An example of how to calculate the CP of the max range of a weapon (so a decent archery example... the correct answer is "you DON'T caculate CP of the max range of a weapon," but an example of how to caculate max range is needed.) In other words, we need a clear example of pull.
- The reach of a ranged weapon is it's effective range. The CP of reach is 1 CP for each 0.5 m, or 2 CP/m According to Wikipedia, an AK-47 has an effective range of 300-450 m. Depending on whether you take the high or low estimate, that's 600-900 CP. (Imagine that we are fighting on an open plain and you have an AK-47 and I have a knife. I can move a few meters every time you get a shot off, so you'll get a dozen chances to shoot me before I reach you. It's potentially like a guy with a knife fighting 20 guys with spears.)
- One nice thing about MaM is that it has been created by people who have really shot bows bows and firearms, have had their arms twisted into submission, been choked out, knocked out, slowly beaten down, been cut by knives, have done full-contact stick fighting, etc. :) I think you are forgetting "kick" in the above CP formula. Kick is Pull for fire arms, and the difference is that you spend the hit points as you pull the trigger, instead of before you pull the trigger. Body-power subtracts from kick before you spend the HP (parrelled to how it effects pull.) So for a 400 meter range weapon, with a kick of 4, the actual "reach" listed on the character sheet would be 100, and the total range would be 400m (4HPx100m.) In that case the reach of the AK would be worth 50 CP, and that would be about right IMHO. (And THAT's why we need an example of Kick in the rules.) -BFGalbraith, Sept. 12, 2006
- The relationship between pull and range is complex, but here's a rough formula: 120 m + (20 m for each +1 pull), but no less than 20m. --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)
I couldn't find any equipment mass calculation rules (they were probably removed when we were attempting "fuzzy size",) which is pretty important in the case of generating Armor.
Armor is way more important (players expect characters to be slowed down by heavy armor.) There are 3 main factors involved in Armor: Cover, Absorption, and Toughness. I would think that for primitive technologies, the mass of this would be something like "(Cover + Absorption + Toughness) times 20% of Carying Capacity = armor mass," and that for advanced technologies it might be something like "(Cover + Absorption + Toughness) times 10% of Carying Capacity = armor mass."
- Here's an empirical approach: For midieval armor divide the mass by the cover bonus and get a "mass per Cvr" value. Then we can divide that by the weight of a large man (100 kg) and get an estimate of the weight per cover for any species (based on that species' upper weight limit.) Modern high-tech armor may be 1% better, and some vital areas of the body require less material to cover and still give a +1 bonus. (For example a titanium chest plate that covers my heart could have +1 cover and +5 absorption, but only weigh 2 or 3 kg.)
Armor Type mass/Cvr Abs Tgh Padded 1% /Cvr 1 2 Leather 2% /Cvr 2 3 Scale 4% /Cvr 3 3 Chainmail 3% /Cvr 3 3 Brigandine 5% /Cvr 4 3 Lamellar 4% /Cvr 4 4 Plate 5% /Cvr 5 4
- The "ideal" formula for the armor's mass is the wearer's mass times the cover and absorption of the armor, divided by 100. Padded, Leather, Chainmail, Lamellar and Plate approach this ideal. Scale and Brigandine are a little less efficient, but they are inexpensive and just as useful in many situations. Toughness is more an economics issue (how much do I want to invest in this much armor?) --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)
We might not want hard and fast rules for weapons, but we might give a "general guidline" of five levels less than it's power bonus.
- If the weapon is mace-like (maximum power, minimum mass) then it could be a whole size level lighter. If the weapon is fist-like (minimum power, maximum mass) it could be a size level heavier. In other words a 1 kg mace has at least as much impact as a 3 kg sword. There is also variation within families of weapons. A sword with a +3 power bonus is not balanced the same as a sword with a +2 power bonus. --SerpLord 14:38, 11 September 2006 (PDT)
Boiler Plate for MaM "Design"
Some adventures are a sequence of challenges like an obstacle course. However, players often want to be able to try anything they want with their characters, so an engaging environment for the characters to freely adventure in - letting the story develop naturally - is usually better than forcing players to follow a story line.
For example, if the PCs are likely to end up fighting in a village market, the GM should have a village market combat map prepared. (Instead, the GM may choose to have a blank sheet of Hex Paper, and use "pieces" to show where various Village Market obstacles are on the hex paper.) The more specific the location, the more important it is for the GM to have a specific map prepared. The GM may also have a selection of general terrain maps, for conflicts that take place in general types of areas, instead of taking place in very specific locations.
You will need one piece for every important character in the game. You will also need a piece for every significant object in the game, which is not already part of a combat map. (By significant object, I mean any visible object that the players are likely to interact with. For example, if there is a discarded spear the players are supposed to find out in the open, it would be best to have a piece for that spear, if it is not part of a map.)
After studying this tutorial, these should be all the reference materials the GM and players need to play the game. Some of the pages can help players create their PCs, others are designed only for the GM's use.
