Editing Talk:MTH:Merits

Origin and Calling section has been moved to a new page. Look for the normal link on the Character page.
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Equipment has been moved to it's own section. Look for the link on the Merits page.
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Equipment was deleted entirely, as all equipment listed there already existed in published material. We DO need a section for equipment though, for Superhero-type equipment that doesn't yet have rules, and to better-categorize some merits. -BunniRabbi
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Hyper-Punch was added back because there need to be rules for creating forced movement with blows backed by super strength. It's unique, but very commonplace in the superhero genre. 
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Hyper-Punch was removed again due to it duplicating two other separate merits. These merits where then consolidated into the Wrecker Fighting Style with similar merits. -BunniRabbi

Also, it was brought to my attention today that forced movement rules are implied as an option under Stylish Execution. If so, we should probably make that more explicit in the section detailing Stylish Execution. I have mixed feelings as to weather forced movement should be something you get through optional mechanics, like merit, or narrative default mechanic, like Stylish Execution. Thoughts?

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What the fuck is wrong with you? 

Forced movement rules are not implied as an option under Stylish Execution, MUCH LESS detailed in any way that is useable. 

Stop treating this wiki as though you own it. Stop deleting things because of the slightest overlap with other things. Hyper-Punch was /nothing/ like Shockwave or Thunderclap, which should not be part of a fighting style. You are aware people are running games with these rules, right? Can you imagine how frustrating it is to have them changed drastically and told that it's because a merit 'duplicates' something it unequivocally does not?

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It's a bit rude to delete parts of discussion while you are responding to them, as opposed to after finishing the discussion.

"Forced movement rules are not implied as an option under Stylish Execution,"
Would that then be a 'yes' on making that explicit?

"MUCH LESS detailed in any way that is useable."
What makes it unusable?

"Stop deleting things because of the slightest overlap with other things."
What do you consider to be the appropriate level of overlap?

"Hyper-Punch was /nothing/ like Shockwave or Thunderclap, which should not be part of a fighting style."
I agree, but I was out-voted.

"Can you imagine how frustrating it is to have them changed drastically and told that it's because a merit 'duplicates' something it unequivocally does not?"
1) There are always people running games. When would you like the Wiki to be edited? 
2) People usually print a copy of the rules when starting a Chronicle.
3) The rational given by the group, the one that was eventually voted-in, was that the Hyper-Punch Merit was thematically an equivalent but mechanically less valuable then the merits in the fighting style. 

If you have an alternative, I'll take it to the group. -BunniRabbi

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No that is not a 'yes' to make it implicit. I don't know if you've read the section on Stylish Execution, but no part of it in any way implies that it provides rules for forced movement whatsoever. Stylish Execution provides bonus die if you do something cool or make a witty quip. That's all it does. Hyper-Punch doesn't even provide bonus die. It allows you to send an opponent flying if your successes exceed their size and you have an adequate level of mega-strength. They are two TOTALLY different mechanics that do not overlap in any way at all. 

I don't know who this group is that happens to be voting on this shit, but I'd like to know why I'm not getting votes? When I check the history, I notice that when I re-added Hyper-Punch there were over a thousand positive votes, and the majority of your edits have negative votes - so if that's what you're referring to, your logic is flawed. 

My alternative is to leave Hyper-Punch the fuck alone. It's fine as it is. Shockwave and Thunderclap were balanced, reasonable merits. They didn't need changing either. If you are making these changes for YOUR game, then make your own set of rules rather than make changes to the wiki that (according to the page history) lots of people disagree with. Didn't you at one point delete the entire equipment section before it was undone (thankfully) by someone else with common sense? 

More than anything, you need to stop deleting things based on idiotic criteria. You deleted Nemesis before I made it into a Flaw, because it was, 'a story element, not a merit'. So what is Mentor? Friend? Staff? They're all story elements you can spend XP on! That's the beauty of Storyteller! In fact, I lifted Nemesis right out of an older White Wolf game, called Adventure! which is a pulp action game where Nemesis was the equivalent of a merit. You deleted Reach because it overlapped SLIGHTLY with Plasticity (in that it allowed a character to have reach), though Plasticity comes with a large number of other benefits which define it as a separate power conceptually - and there is no weakness to limit those other benefits to emulate the effect I want to achieve mechanically. Now, before you say that I should just have my own set of rules which include Reach as a power... why? I'd rather this wiki have a lot of unique powers rather than the bare minimum to be functional, and then leave it up to GM's individually to cut out what they don't want to include. 
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Lightning Dodge was edited to be more balanced and realistic. Having *EITHER* a dexterity or wits of 4+ is absurd. That implies that someone with Wits 1 (meaning oblivious) and a Dex of 4 (not even the human peak), could dodge a bullet. Even humans at the peak of perceptiveness and evasiveness cannot dodge bullets, let alone someone with a Dex of 1 (meaning feeble) and a Wits of 4 (above average in observance). I get that it's a superhero game, but let's try and be remotely realistic when it comes to abilities like this? Random mobsters should not be capable of dodging bullets.