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| The following is Byron Hall and "Burnout"s infamous rebuttal to [http://www.rpg.net/reviews/archive/14/14567.phtml MacLennan & Sartin's infamous review] of ... well, the infamous [[Worst RPGs ever#F.A.T.A.L.|F.A.T.A.L]]. (Starting to sense a pattern here?) I'm putting it here because searching for it on the web returns a 404 error; I believe it's OK to put here, since it was a public statement placed on a public forum. Fortunately I saved a copy before it went away into the depths of 'No page found'.
| | Your articles are for when it aoblsutley, positively, needs to be understood overnight. |
| | |
| I did some tweaking of the formatting (in particular, changing some colors so it would show up better on a white background), but the text is essentially unchanged--so if you hate the formatting, blame ''them''. (My notes are in black italic text.)
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| | |
| Note that I had to split it into five parts because of the sheer size of the file; this rebuttal quotes ''all'' of the original S&M review.
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| | |
| Have fun reading it... --[[User:Knockwood|Lord Knockwood the Mad]] 04:07, 18 Jun 2005 (PDT)
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| | |
| '''EDIT:''' All right, the legal status of this is questionable.
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| | |
| I ''believe'' it was intended for public consumption, as it was on the public web, and didn't have a copyright or other notice. The editing I mentioned earlier was strictly format; the ''text'' of the original was not changed.
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| | |
| But, who knows what evil lurks in the minds of men... especially lawyers. So, two things:
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| # Please do not change the text of the reviews--though ''adding'' to them is all right; and
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| # If someone from FATAL Games wants this removed, please send email, and we'll remove it.
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| | |
| I hope we can resolve this without too much conflict... --[[User:Knockwood|Lord Knockwood the Mad]] 20:19, 18 Jun 2005 (PDT)
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| | |
| ----
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| <p align="center"><b><font size="4">CHILDISH REVIEW AND AUTHOR'S DEFENSE OF F.A.T.A.L.</font></b></p>
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| <p>Perhaps the most negative review ever written, RPG.net posted a review of F.A.T.A.L. on
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| 4/10/3 and removed it on 4/13/3 from the following page: http://www.rpg.net/reviews/archive/9/9222.phtml ''(Long gone by now, but saved [http://atrocities.primaryerror.net/fatal.html here]. Then again, most of it is quoted here anyway. --Kwd {But [http://www.rpg.net/reviews/archive/14/14567.phtml here] as of March 2010 --MDK})''</p>
| |
| <p>Although it is technically not a review, but mostly an attack against me, Byron Hall, I
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| will demonstrate the fallacies of the authors, Darren MacLennan and Jason Sartin.
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| Obviously, they hate F.A.T.A.L. and anyone involved with the game. Their hatred can be
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| only the result of fear. They are fearful because they know it will be published. They are
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| fearful because the material in the game is supported, and is dissimilar to anything that
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| attracts them. People fear what is different to them, mostly out of cognitive laziness; it
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| takes effort to explore what is different. Nonetheless, I appreciate the attention to the
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| game, and inefficient effort.</p>
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| <p>As a preface, understand that their fear caused them to react emotionally. Their
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| attempted review is only an emotional outburst and lacks substance. I do not need to
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| rely on emotional appeals (no matter how funny and persuasive they can be), and will show
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| the stupidity of their arguments, point by point, with reason. Although rhetoric is
| |
| effective, it is the lowest form of debate. So that it is clear who is who, Darren’s
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| text is yellow, Jason’s is pink, and mine is FATAL red.</p>
| |
| | |
| ''('''Note:''' For the version here, the colors are different: Darren's is green, and Hall's is black--except for notes like this one, of course.)''
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| | |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I will also be commenting on this review. I am John, or
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| as some people know me, Burnout. I have been an active contributor to the FATAL text since
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| its conception. So my opinions may be very useful.</font></p>
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| <p><font color="#009900">There is no God, and the proof of this can be found in a .pdf
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| file from [http://www.fatalgames.com Fatal Games]</font></p>
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| <p>I wish that were true.</p>
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| <p><font color="#009900">If this is the first time that you've ever heard of FATAL, you're
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| in for a fun ride. Well, let me rephrase: You're in for a "fun ride" if you
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| consider a fun ride to be, say, hitting your nutsack with a tack hammer. For about four
| |
| hours.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
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| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: The nutsack/tack hammer thing wouldn't be a fun ride, but it is
| |
| preferable to actually playing FATAL.</font></p>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">. . .</font></p>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Oh, hi. I'm [mailto:darkmind@hotmail.com Jason Sartin]. You may remember me from such classic
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| RPGnet moments as "the longest fucking SenZar review ever" and all those
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| humanity-hating and "go kill yourself already" posts I leave on Tangency. I'll
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| be helping Darren a lot with this review, because friends don't let friends review FATAL
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| alone.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Also, this is
| |
| obviously going to be one of those grandstanding "spectacle" reviews that tries
| |
| to be crowd-pleasing. Those of you who hate that kind of review should do the honorable
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| thing and whine your asses off in the forum below.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">So, Jason establishes his credibility, or
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| lack thereof. He delivers, as promised, a review congruent with his
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| "humanity-hating" and "kill yourself" reputation. As I said, his
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| arguments lack substance, but readers will see that soon. Could his approach be
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| considered juvenile? Ask yourself this question again later.</p>
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| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: Ahhh what a
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| spectacle this review was. It got pulled off of the Website 3 days after it was posted.
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| Sounds crowd pleasing to me.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
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| <p><font color="#009900">You think I'm joking. You think that I'm exaggerating for comic
| |
| effect. But you will be nodding your head with agreement, and also holding your swollen,
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| bruised nutsack if you ever happen to open the FATAL .pdf up and give it anything but the
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| most cursory of readthroughs.</font></p>
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| <p>By the way, Darren fails to properly introduce himself. He is a moderator at
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| RPG.net, and therefore represents their on-line community. Obviously, he is
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| entertained with the thought of male readers hitting their "swollen, bruised
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| nutsack" with a tack hammer. Consider the credibility, or lack thereof, of
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| Darren. Consider the credibility, or lack thereof, of RPG.net, as he represents
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| them.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
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| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
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| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: He's not joking, people, and I wasn't, either. Those of you
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| wondering what the most ass-tastic RPG of all time would look like - the one whose suck
| |
| factor will forever demolish all challengers and tower over the ages with all the majesty
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| of a homeless, mindless, drooling, shit-obsessed, impotent moron standing on a mountain of
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| used Dragon Ball Z condoms - can finally die in peace. </font></p>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">The arguments are
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| over. Anyone who says anything else is the worst RPG ever will...well, I'll inject
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| kerosene into my bladder, piss on them, and then set them on fire. This game sucks THAT
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| much.</font></p>
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| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: I find the
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| wording Sartin uses here very contradictory to his review. Just remember this statement,
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| "well, I'll inject kerosene into my bladder, piss on them, and then set them on
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| fire."</font></p>
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| | |
| <blockquote>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Godfuckingdammit.
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| We're hardly four words into the review, and already the game has dragged me down to its
| |
| level.</font></p>
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| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
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| <p>Any child can rant. What matters is the quality of the argument. Jason is
| |
| not being dragged anywhere, but responds like this because it is who he is, and would do
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| better to own up to it. I intend to show that the substance of my argument is
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| superior, and that Jason should be dragged up to it.</p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">So, why is it so bad?</font></p>
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| | |
| <p>Do tell.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p><font color="#009900">'Cause it's the Necronomicon of role-playing games. Not in the
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| cool way, where it's a source of occult knowledge with a terrible, terrible price. It's
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| the Necronomicon in the sense that if you leave a printed copy on your shelf with other
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| RPGs, then the other RPGs will be clustered around the dead, violated body of one of its
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| own in the morning. FATAL will most likely be down at the station in the sex crimes
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| interrogation room, trying its best to put on an innocent face and failing miserably.</font>.</p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
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| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Another useful comparison is that FATAL is basically anti-thought.
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| As you can already see, it reacts violently with real sentience.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>...as opposed to unreal sentience? I'm getting bored looking for a real argument.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p><font color="#009900">See, [http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_4762.html Synnibarr] was bad, but
| |
| you have to like Synnibarr. </font></p>
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| <p><font color="#009900">Yes, it's a terrible role-playing game in just about every
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| respect, but it's got heart; it's like a punch-drunk, half-blind boxer who hasn't realized
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| that his manager is now "arranging fights" by pushing him in front of a speeding
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| Mack truck and ringing a bell. He's going to get a license plate number embossed into his
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| skull, but he's still out there, still trying. </font></p>
| |
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| <p><font color="#009900">Raven c.s. McCracken, although he's made the occasional misstep,
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| also seems like a decent guy; just a tad misguided when it comes to writing games. There's
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| an innocence to Synnibarr, a lack of subterfuge that makes it fun to think about, if not
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| to read. If nothing else, it's the only game that I've seen so far that has a Midnight
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| Sunstone Bazooka in it.</font></p>
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| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
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| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
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| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Yeah. I like how World of Synnibarr is uniquely deranged. The
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| first time I read through it, I knew I would never see anything else quite like it, like
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| only McCracken could have made a game that's fucked up the way Synnibarr is fucked up.
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| It's the Plan 9 From Outer Space of RPGs...its execution was horrible, but its wrongness
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| has this charming quality to it, and I can't help liking it nowadays. I've actually got
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| more entertainment out of it than most of the "good" games I own, and I don't
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| regret buying it, so in a bizarre way, McCracken actually succeeded. </font></p>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">But even compared to
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| Synnibarr's few and faint good points, FATAL doesn't have anything going for it.</font></p>
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| <p>Nothing at all? I can't wait to address some actual points. Can anyone say...sophistry?</p>
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| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: Yeah, isn't this supposed to be a review of FATAL, not
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| Synnibar?</font></p>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">It's the shitty game
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| to end all shitty games, and it could have been written by any 14 year old with an
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| obsession with rape and defecation, no design skill, a warez copy of Photoshop, and months
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| and months of lifeless weekends to work on it. Seriously, if Byron Hall and McCracken got
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| into a RPG design fight, McCracken would reduce Hall to sucking his wang so fast every
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| streetwalker in Las Vegas would be taking notes.</font></p>
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| </blockquote>
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| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: For someone
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| saying this game could be made by a 14-year old, Sartin sure does sound like one. I don't
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| remember the last time I used the word "wang." I find the players of FATAL and I
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| mature enough to use words like penis, dick, or cock...without giggling like Sartin
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| obviously is after saying "wang."</font></p>
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| <blockquote>
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| <p><font color="#009900">FATAL - well, if Synnibarr is [http://www.timecube.com timecube.com], then
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| FATAL is tubgirl.com. (That last link, incidentally, is NOT WORK
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| SAFE IN THE SLIGHTEST.)</font>
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| ''(Note: I disabled the link. That's not the kind of thing you want to accidentally see. --Kwd)''
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| <font color="#009900">It's a product so twisted, so fundamentally broken in its attitude
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| towards sexuality, so unbelievably stupid that you'd think that the authors are trying to
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| make themselves look like they're prime candidates for institutionalization. They're not,
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| which makes it even scarier.</font></p>
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| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
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| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
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| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: By the way, you'll notice lots and lots of these personal attacks
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| on the creator and players of this game as this drags on. </font></p>
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| </blockquote>
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| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
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| auto;margin-left:.5in">I'm convinced, that's the best Jason can do.</p>
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| <blockquote>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">While this is bad form
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| in normal RPG reviews, it's hard to avoid here. For one, it's impossible for a game
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| designer we shouldn't insult to create a game this goddamn stupid. For another, Hall and
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| his personal drooling fanboys went out of their way to honor RPGnet's forums with their
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| personal shot at the world record for "number of flame threads started before one's
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| daily basement Necronomicon (Waldenbooks version) reading". And you know, I think
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| they won it, too.</font></p>
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| </blockquote>
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| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Give credit where credit is due. I did
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| introduce my game, but I always posted professionally and addressed actual points.
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| All flames were by RPGnetters, except for when two players in my group posted aggressively
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| in my defense.</p>
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| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: As RPGnetters
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| know, I am one of those two. I reacted emotionally in that flamewar, which is very unusual
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| for me. I found it funny how during the days in question only one legitimate argument came
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| up...the question of why there wasn't any homosexuals in the game. Due to some good points
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| brought up by one person (I can't remember the name) this has since been changed.</font></p>
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| | |
| <blockquote>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">For those who weren't
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| there, the flame wars weren't very interesting. It was all simply another chapter in the
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| long-ass book of moron game designers who have created the "BEST GAEM EVAR!!!"
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| Except that in this chapter, the obligatory AD&D clone featured vagina circumference
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| stats and rape rolls, and the moron game designer's followers had all the class and brain
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| activity of scrotum lint.</font></p>
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| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Well, Jason's certainly right, it wasn't
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| very interesting, mainly because the majority of the criticism was as emotional and
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| unsupported as you've just read.</p>
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| <blockquote>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Oh, they want to be
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| all evil and shocking and crap. God, how pathetically they tried. I mean, imagine opening
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| a door to find your mother and sister raping each other with pink strap-ons. And you then
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| realize that you've never seen their bare asses before, because you're pretty sure you
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| would have remembered the swastikas tattooed there. And upon noticing you, they grin
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| wickedly and give you the finger in unison.</font></p>
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| </blockquote>
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| | |
| <blockquote>
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| <p>For the record, I've never tried to prove to RPGnetters that I'm evil and shocking. In
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| fact, I've never tried to prove anything to them, except that their arguments are either
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| emotional or poorly considered. I don't believe that Darren or Jason will ever be
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| reasonable in debate. I am always willing to debate anything to do with FATAL, and I will
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| always be professional while debating.</p>
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| </blockquote>
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| | |
| <blockquote>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">It's shocking in a way
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| that instantly blights out all rational thought, but later, you'll have to admit the
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| finger and wicked grinning part was kinda cool.</font></p>
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| | |
| <p>Bear in mind that Jason referred to rational thought, as though familiar with it.</p>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">That's the feeling the
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| FATAL morons so wish they could provoke.</font></p>
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| </blockquote>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">I think it is Darren and Jason who wish to
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| provoke feelings, for lack of a better approach.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Instead, they're more
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| like opening that door to find your weeks-unwashed Otaku brother in his soiled underwear,
| |
| masturbating furiously to - of all the goddamn things in the world - an ''Archie'' comic. And
| |
| on his bare ass is a tattoo of, inexplicably, someone ''else's'' ass, and he's disgustingly
| |
| fat enough for it to be a good 14 inches across. And as he goes at it, he's quietly
| |
| moaning to himself about how worthless women, fags, and niggers are and how they should
| |
| all be raped or murdered.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Wrong. I don't have a brother (Are you
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| projecting? What was your brother like?), a tattoo, and I don't consider women,
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| homosexuals, and blacks to be worthless, nor deserving of rape and murder. If you're
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| suggesting that because rape is covered in the game (on 2 pages out of 900), that I
| |
| support it (it's only detailed under Overbearing in Wrestling, and Sociality...where a
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| footnote supports the historical accuracy), then anyone who plays nearly any role-playing
| |
| game supports murder (or killing, which may be a better definition), because murder
| |
| (killing) is usually the focus of nearly all games. I guarantee that a comparison of the
| |
| percentage of a work devoted to murder or killing is higher in other RPG's than rape is in
| |
| FATAL.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">In fact, I've included numerous things with
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| which I diagree in FATAL, such as gods, an ethical-moral system, etc. Jason probably knows
| |
| that his conclusions are faulty, but is apparently willing to be at fault. I am not.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: I personally
| |
| think that rape and murder come up, whether behind closed doors or out in the open, in at
| |
| least 90% of gaming groups. FATAL just makes it so you see exactly how bad it actually is
| |
| by trying not to hide it or pretend it didn't happen. Instead on those pages you'll find
| |
| information supported by references on how often it happened and what happened to the
| |
| criminal. Now does this mean anybody who plays FATAL supports it? No, it simply shows that
| |
| most people try to sweep it under the rug. We know it is, unfortunately, a day-to-day
| |
| occurence.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
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| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">It's still disturbing
| |
| on all kinds of levels. But it's the kind of stupid disturbing that ends with you having
| |
| to answer questions to the satisfaction of a prosecuting attorney.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p>If the law must consider something to be disturbing, it is the libelous approach of
| |
| Darren and Jason.</p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Point is, the
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| FATALites have repeatedly proven that treating them with any respect or dignity is
| |
| pointless, so we're not going to waste your time or ours with the effort. Back in their
| |
| raving lunatic days, I had thought that Raven c.s. McCracken and the SenZar guys had been
| |
| full of it, but Byron Hall and his fellow lobotomy candidates made them look like Rebecca
| |
| Borgstrom on a prozac bender.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Again, if it is to be debated as to which
| |
| party deserves respect, I'll let the reader draw their own conclusion.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: They refuse
| |
| to waste time showing dignity or respect, but spend pages upon pages showing the opposite.
| |
| I would like to state that I prefer being called a Fatalist, not a FATALite.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">But don't worry! None
| |
| of this will be a problem, because even if you can ignore the misogynistic, homophobic,
| |
| racist, and all-around idiotic mindset of its core supporters, FATAL blows goats with such
| |
| panache that it's hard to imagine anyone looking at it and not concluding that Hall
| |
| should've given up the needle.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">By the way, you may notice that I write the "authors"
| |
| of the game, rather than "author". There's a reason for this: While the game
| |
| lists only a single author, there are many signs that lead me to believe that Ye Olde
| |
| Abominatione has more than one author, although uncredited. You'll find an explanation
| |
| later, but I just wanted to get that out of the way.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Several pages will credit a multitude of people for everything from design to
| |
| play-testing. All ideas were submitted to me, and written or re-written by me. The credits
| |
| section of FATAL will not only list people, but describe who is responsible for what. Many
| |
| have asked in e-mails why it is not part of the free version. This, I refuse to answer
| |
| until after it is printed.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: As stated earlier, I have been a contributor to this
| |
| game and know that it will be shown later. But my own words are not shown in the text
| |
| (that I know of). I bring up my views to Byron during normal conversation or game-testing,
| |
| and if disproved by scholarship it does not show up in the text. On the other hand, if
| |
| there is nothing to disprove my point and it seems logical, it will most likely be
| |
| researched and added as needed.</font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Meanwhile, you'll notice I've simply gone with acting like there's
| |
| one author. What can I say? It's easier when there's only one
| |
| legendary-industry-boob-for-the-next-ten-years to blame, and the thought that another
| |
| human being actually said to him "Hey, FATAL sounds really cool. Let me contribute to
| |
| it!" is too depressing to contemplate. </font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Let's start with the title page.</font></p>
| |
| <p>It's about time.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Yeah, it's that bad.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: (a la Duff Man) Oh, yeah! (/Duff Man) "FANTASY ADVENTURE TO
| |
| ADULT LECHERY" in crappy you-can-see-the-asses-of-the-little-engraved-figures font.
| |
| Right inside a border made up entirely of random "garbage" characters. </font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in">Even the moment I created this logo (I hesitate to call it that) in PhotoShop, I did not want
| |
| to use it. Currently, a logo is being designed by a professional artist. As it should be
| |
| known, the game is available free while it is being developed. Much has changed, and much
| |
| will before I'm ready to unleash it upon the world in full force. At the moment,
| |
| fatalgames.com is completely unadvertised, for the same reason. By the way, the characters
| |
| around the edge of the 'logo' actually spell FATAL and other appropriate things. I can't
| |
| wait to see the final logo!</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">While we're on it, if you can queue up "Optimistic", by
| |
| Radiohead, you'll have a good idea of how the both of us feel right now.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I'm unfamiliar with that song. I prefer to listen to
| |
| much more musically-complicated bands and artists.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">FATAL claims to be "the most difficult, detailed, realistic
| |
| and historically/mythically accurate role-playing game available."</font></p>
| |
| <p>FATAL lives up to its claim, only the reviewers don't know it. As I refute arguments
| |
| about the game, I'll demonstrate this.</p>
| |
| <p align="center" style="text-align:center"><font color="#009900">'''This is the most damnable lie I have ever seen in my history as an RPG reviewer.'''</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I just can't let this go. Show me one game where it is
| |
| more difficult to achieve goals, level-up, acquire treasure, or just stay alive. Also, I'd
| |
| like to see a game that gives you a more detailed of what skills can be done on a
| |
| day-to-day basis as well as adventuring. As far as realistic and historically/mythically
| |
| accurate, I truly believe that for the period and realm in which the game exists, it is
| |
| more accurate than anything I have seen.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">In no sense is that statement true; as a matter of fact, in every
| |
| sense of the word, that statement is so false as to provide the golden mean for statements
| |
| of falsehood. FATAL is difficult only in the sense that peeling your face off a strip at a
| |
| time is difficult; detailed only in the respects that give the creators an erection;
| |
| realistic - Jesus, I can't even go into it - historically/mythically accurate only in the
| |
| sense that its creators occupy the same physical world that these myths originated upon,
| |
| and about as accurate as banging your ass on the keyboard to write the Gettysburg Address.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>If you believe FATAL is not the most difficult game (soon to be) on the market, then at
| |
| least offer counter-evidence. Which game do you consider to be more difficult? If you
| |
| believe FATAL is not the most detailed game (soon to be) on the market, then at least
| |
| offer counter-evidence. Which game do you consider to be more detailed? You get the idea.
| |
| Darren makes a claim, and then offers no support.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: Even beyond that, what makes it less difficult? How is
| |
| it less detailed? Throughout their review you can make note that they never prove anything
| |
| about the difficulty or detail.</font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Darren is correct, but it should be noted that this is actually a
| |
| good title page, as it neatly hints at much (though by no means all) of what sucks about
| |
| this game. </font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">ADULT LECHERY? Perhaps
| |
| it's nitpicking to point out the redundancy (oooh, oooh! What's next? The fantasy game of
| |
| "violent combat"? The sci-fi game of "starfaring space travel"? The
| |
| White Wolf game of "ah fuck it, just gimme the cool powers already"?), but it's
| |
| a good indicator of the level of thought that went into the whole game. And, of course, it
| |
| reminds you that this won't be just another Tolkien-clone RPG, but a ''raping and shitting''
| |
| Tolkien-clone RPG!</font></p>
| |
| | |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Does Jason think before he writes? Adult
| |
| lechery could easily be different from minor lechery, which I want to avoid at all costs.
| |
| This game is for adults only, and involves lechery. Likewise, it is possible to have a
| |
| game for adults only, and that has no sexual content at all. Just the same, I was never
| |
| comfortable with the title, and see it as the opposite of G.U.R.P.S. in one respect. I
| |
| consider what GURPS stands for to be well-conceived: Generic Universal Role-Playing
| |
| System. Unfortunately, the title itself (GURPS) is unattractive, nonsensical when alone,
| |
| and a failure in marketing and branding. Conversely, FATAL seems an excellent name for the
| |
| game for many reasons. Compared to other RPG's, the game system is definitely more fatal
| |
| for a character. The beginning of the other part of the name, Fantasy Adventure, is
| |
| perfect as far as I'm concerned. I dislike 'To Adult Lechery', mainly because it places a
| |
| disproportionate degree of attention on sex. However, this is one element that separates
| |
| it from other games, so I guess it's not so horrible. Still, a better name could be spun.
| |
| I just wanted to point out that Jason was wrong, 'Adult Lechery' is not redundant.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">DIFFICULT? Oh, yeah.
| |
| Anyone with the force of will to endure reading all 900+ pages of this homesick abortion
| |
| of a game (without going insane and making sacrifices to sweet Azathoth for a merciful
| |
| annihilation of the universe) is no one to be fucked with. And anyone who could do that
| |
| and actually play by its anal-retentive trip to hell of a rules system (without succumbing
| |
| to Hall's probable compulsion to inhale Draino by the assloads) would have to be some kind
| |
| of demigod.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: Let's just
| |
| take out the rhetoric out of that and see what happens. "Oh, yeah. Anyone with the
| |
| force of will to endure reading all 900+ pages of this...game...is no one to be fucked
| |
| with. And anyone who could do that and actually play by its...rules system...would have to
| |
| be some kind of demigod." I personally see this as a compliment. Even though I don't
| |
| consider myself a demigod, I do consider myself someone not to be fucked with. So thanks
| |
| Sartin.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">And yes, it's saying
| |
| difficult like it's a good thing.</font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">But hey, ain't that
| |
| ALWAYS the eternal struggle of gaming? "Play a difficult game and get massive
| |
| headaches because it's needlessly complicated and
| |
| PC-killing-because-I-accidentally-dropped-my-rusty-dagger-and-impaled-my-favorite-intestinal-tract"
| |
| versus "Go with something that won't make me roll five times on the Random Shit
| |
| Discoloration Table every time I cast Light My Finger and thus spend more time actually
| |
| doing things"?</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">FATAL has been played in a comparison with
| |
| AD&D 2e, and it does not generally require more die rolls (except, for example, in the
| |
| case of Crucial Damage), nor does it take longer to do anything. My question to Jason is:
| |
| have you played the game or merely thumbed through it? Whether you choose to show respect
| |
| or not, you're showing incompetence by reviewing a product without play-testing it.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: Also, it's
| |
| not needlessly PC killing. It's realistically PC killing. If you drop a dagger you're not
| |
| going to puncture an intestinal tract. But, if you get stabbed two or three times with
| |
| that rusty dagger you will have a little less than 50-50 chance of survival. Seems better
| |
| than DnD where you can get slashed by a dragon, and if high enough level, probably
| |
| survive.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">REALISTIC AND
| |
| HISTORICALLY/MYTHICALLY ACCURATE? Oh, I bet.</font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">Player 1: R0XX0R! This is the best system for emulating the myths of
| |
| Heracles I've ever seen! And it's fucking sweet how all the gods, monsters, and heroes
| |
| can't do anything that wouldn't be possible in real life! </font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">FATAL
| |
| does not specialize in ancient Greek mythology, although elements of it have been included
| |
| or influential. Faulty criticism is worthless when exposed, and discreidts only the critic
| |
| thereafter, not FATAL or myself. Does Jason understand that?</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">Player 2: Hell,
| |
| yeah. When I was trying to get past Cerberus, he wasn't any tougher than a pit bull with
| |
| two extra rubber heads! And later, when I was masturbating on the temple altar and I
| |
| angered the gods, they didn't do anything but just Not Appear. Dude, you can't HANDLE the
| |
| realism!</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: Actually,
| |
| I'm quite sure Cerberus would be much more difficult in FATAL due to the size factor
| |
| causing more or less damage, depending on larger or smaller. More than likely if you got
| |
| bit by Cerberus in FATAL he would simply tear you in two. I definitely wouldn't try unless
| |
| I was using trebuchets from a great distance.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">Player 1: W00T! If
| |
| this were any more realistic, you'd be able to TASTE the penis length!</font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">Player 2: Testify!
| |
| Lots of people in history had penises, so it's ultra realistic and historically accurate
| |
| to put in rules about that!</font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">Player 1: Man, I
| |
| could cream myself just thinking about this! I can't WAIT to see if it has rules for hut
| |
| building, grass growing, nose picking, and the spread of Christianity, since people
| |
| experienced those during history, too!</font></p>
| |
| | |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:1.0in;margin-left:1.0in">It is important to note that the spread of
| |
| Christianity has been removed from FATAL. This game is the most historically/mythically
| |
| accurate, given its premises. For example, it should be obvious that it is accurate to
| |
| medieval Europe, however it is noted on the first page that one exception is that gods are
| |
| assumed to exist. Therefore, the game assumes that pantheons were not replaced by
| |
| Christianity, as they were in Europe. Just the same, I am thankful Jason showed his
| |
| oversight to me. I will make it more clear so that others are not so easily confused.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">So, yeah. </font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Okay, I gave the
| |
| subtitle more attention than it deserved. Let's just say that if Hall set out to write ONE
| |
| FUCKING LINE that instantly screams that the ensuing RPG will be very nearly as cool as
| |
| getting diagnosed with cancer and Necrotizing Fasciitis bacteria on the same day, he succeeded brilliantly.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">And for the fun part, the FATAL Games logo is "Where the
| |
| dice never lie." I would suggest that the owners of FATAL Games must have dice that
| |
| come up "THIS GAME SUCKS, BEAVIS" no matter how they are thrown, or we must
| |
| chalk this up as yet another falsehood.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Yeah, I really like that logo, too. It was nice of the FATALites
| |
| to point out that when you play games from other companies, your dice may lie to you. Ha,
| |
| I knew it! All those times I was playing D&D or SenZar, and that d20 would show a 3 or
| |
| some shit when I knew I rolled a 20. Thanks, FATAL, for showing me the way! </font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in">Jason made a logical mistake in his assumption: The subtitle "Where the Dice Never
| |
| Lie" does not necessarily imply that dice from other companies lie. In fact, the
| |
| subtitle serves a useful purpose, and has a great history. The phrase, "the dice
| |
| never lie" was coined by Jim Hausler, a good friend and contributor. Many years ago,
| |
| we were playing AD&D 2e, and whenever die-rolls were to his advantage, he bellowed
| |
| "the dice never lie!" At any rate, Fatal Games can be confused with, say,
| |
| computer games. By having 'dice' in the subtitle, it makes it clear that it is for dice
| |
| games.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">No, wait. This game
| |
| still proves once and for all that Darwin was an ass-grabbing fool.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Darwin was a great man.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Oh, and did I forget to mention that it's nine hundred pages
| |
| long?</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">This is why I summoned help from Jason Sartin, people.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Funny, I've introduced many to the game, and very few were overwhelmed. Some people are
| |
| more capable than others.</p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Yeah, thanks. Now watch, by the end, I'll probably have to summon
| |
| someone else to help me. We'll have Justin Bacon or Scott Lynch or Elissa Carey or some
| |
| other poor bastard down here to write the closing paragraph and talk me out of climbing a
| |
| tower and shooting random basement-dwelling losers. </font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Mmmmmm...killing
| |
| potential FATALites...</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">There is a difference between games and
| |
| people. Jason seems unable to make that distinction. Why so personal?</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">But yeah. It's nine
| |
| hundred pages long, and you can hardly turn one page without seeing something that's
| |
| desperately stupid or sucking or screaming "Look how COOL and HISTORICALLY ACCURATE
| |
| and HUGE DICKED I am, because I'm terrified you won't notice!". You can see the bind
| |
| we're in.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>AD&D 2e, when considering all rulebooks, far exceeded 900 pages. I mention this
| |
| game because of its popularity. AD&D 2e, however, seemed to offer numerous books to
| |
| financially take advantage of consumers, otherwise known as a good business strategy. I
| |
| refuse to do so, and believe gamers would rather have it all together without redundancy.
| |
| I will continue to refute claims that FATAL is not historically accurate, given its
| |
| premises. So far, arguments by Darren and Jason are weak in this respect. Oh, and I
| |
| never once mentioned the size of my personal manhood, regardless of how proud of it I am.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I would just like to take this time to do some adding.
| |
| Hmm, DnD 3e Player's Handbook, 301 pages...Dungeon Master's Guide, 256 pages...Psionics
| |
| Handbook, 156 pages. Now that's 713 right there and I know there are many more books in
| |
| the DnD 3e collection.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">This is from the second page:</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">"For instance, assume you are an adventuring knight who has
| |
| just fought his way to the top of a dark tower where you find a comely young maiden
| |
| chained to the wall. Some may choose to free the whimpering wench. Others may free her
| |
| while hoping to win her heart. Instead of seeking affection, some may talk to her to see
| |
| if they can collect a reward for her safe return. Then again, others may be more
| |
| interested in negotiating freedom for fellatio. Some may think she has no room to bargain
| |
| and take their fleshly pleasures by force. Others would rather kill her, dismember her
| |
| young cadaver, and feast on her warm innards."</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">So, basically, FATAL is the date rape RPG.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Another faulty conclusion drawn by Darren. Where is dating included? More to the point,
| |
| multiple ways of role-playing are mentioned, ranging from 'good' to 'evil' (though in real
| |
| life I hesitate to use those terms). Why he focuses on rape is for him to answer. As
| |
| mentioned elsewhere, FATAL is intended to be comprehensive, and if examined, the reader
| |
| will find balance between 'good' and 'evil'.</p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: It's also the cock fruit, attacking turd, and (of course) gay
| |
| buttfucking ogre RPG, but one thing at a time! (It's like an express train full of things
| |
| designed to hurt your mind; just when you think that it's finished running you over,
| |
| another car hits you, grinding yet another valuable part of your soul beneath its wheels.)</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in">Obviously, it is a game that attempts to provide a balance of all things, a true system in which a
| |
| gamer can do anything they want, provided the others around the table have similar views.
| |
| For example, it's also the courtly love and chivalry RPG, but anyone who is a competent
| |
| reviewer would offer a representative sample of the game, not just that which fascinates
| |
| them.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">There's not really a whole lot of ways that I can get around
| |
| this: FATAL, as a whole, is your chance to stop being the good guy and start being the
| |
| soulless rapist that you and your tiny clique of brain-dead morons knew they could be. You
| |
| can come home from a long day of being shunned by anybody with a soul, wipe the Mace from
| |
| your eyes, scuttle down into the cold concrete of the basement and engage in what amounts
| |
| to a verbal circle-jerk with a clique of people just as terribly broken as you are.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Consistent with my previous comment, FATAL also provides a chance to be ethical and
| |
| moral beyond any other RPG. Although I philosophically disagree with the foundations of
| |
| the disposition system, it is more thorough and coherent in terms of ethics and morals
| |
| than any other RPG. I doubt that either Darren or Jason read the game, other than thumbing
| |
| through for ammunition to support their biases. By the way, it is best to avoid
| |
| redundancies, like a "soulless rapist". Again, Darren should think before he
| |
| writes.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: A couple of additions to that, if you don't mind, Byron.
| |
| It's also the grocery-getter, castle-building, weapon- and armor-forging, king-serving,
| |
| self-serving, or master-serving RPG. Just wanted to point out some of how many more
| |
| detailed options there are for a PC rather than just saying an NPC does all the un-fun
| |
| (for lack of a better term) acts.</font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: I'll cut in here to say that while being a brain-dead rapist is an
| |
| important part of the FATAL experience, there are two further aspects that make it the
| |
| visible-from-space pile of festering associty that it is. </font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">1) Juvenile ideas that
| |
| even the SenZar guys would've been too embarrassed to touch. You know, like magical
| |
| fumbles that cause clones to spawn from your cock, or make you shit constantly, or make
| |
| you start anal-fisting your target while trying to bite your ear, or make you recite
| |
| stupid lines that were probably ripped off from metal songs every time you cast a spell.
| |
| Or magical ingredients like vaginal yeast or the "cunt-pipe" of an elderly
| |
| virgin.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: I would like
| |
| to jump in here and say that maybe the reason for the embarrassment is that they aren't
| |
| mature enough to handle such issues.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Remember when I asked you, the reader, to
| |
| consider whether or not Jason's responses are juvenile? While I admit that FATAL has some
| |
| juvenile-level humor in it, it is interesting that Jason seems to be a hypocrite: he
| |
| accuses FATAL of being juvenile, when his responses here, and elsewhere according to
| |
| himself, have a higher proportion of it, word for word, and far fewer instances of
| |
| professionalism. Thank you for remembering. </p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">2) Rules so
| |
| mind-bogglingly stupid and complicated that you'd beg for a no holds barred
| |
| Rifts/Synnibarr crossover instead. Note that this can overlap with the juvenile ideas,
| |
| like with how likely you are to critical hit someone's clitoris, or the magical fumble
| |
| that makes your nutsack swell to 10d1000 (inches, we can only presume, it's not labeled)
| |
| for the next 3d3 days.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Although Jason admits that he is unable to
| |
| comprehend the game that he reviews, its rules that are
| |
| "mind-bogglingly...complicated" support my argument that, at least for him,
| |
| FATAL is the most difficult RPG available. I'd like to rest my case, but his emotions are
| |
| running strong, so I'll continue to support this argument when necessary.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">But like I said, one
| |
| thing at a time.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Please, don't get boggled down.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">While we're still on
| |
| the second page, by the way, check out that first sentence: "Welcome to a fantasy
| |
| medieval role-playing game that focuses on realism and detail whenever possible ''without
| |
| sacrificing fun.''" (Emphasis mine.)</font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Later, when you've
| |
| seen Hall's idea of "realism and detail without sacrificing fun", you'll be
| |
| invited to laugh bitterly with me.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">I'm willing to bet the reader will be
| |
| laughing <em>at</em> you, not <em>with</em> you.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">You know, it occurs to me that most games of FATAL are probably
| |
| played with only the one hand, since -</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Ow.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">OW. OW. FUCK. MY FUCKING BRAIN. OW.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Remind me not to go down that path again.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Would it do any good? I can rise above that level. Can Darren?</p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Not so fast! You forgot to picture them being the only gamers who
| |
| have to wipe off their dice when they're done! I'd bet nothing but nothing will jinx your
| |
| dice faster than leaving someone's semen on them. Hell, when it happens, the FATALites
| |
| probably laugh and shout (a la Saruman) "You will taste MAN JUICE!" Ugh. (Stop
| |
| putting IMAGES INTO MY GODDAMN MIND, DAMMIT. OW!)</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in">It seems like Jason gleefully went much further with Darren's idea, but is ashamed to admit
| |
| how he thinks.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">See, here's the thing: Vampire is a game that can also be
| |
| classified as a date-rape game. You're a vampire, a mythic creature who's been sexualized
| |
| by about three hundred years worth of literature into a romantic creature; and yet, as a
| |
| vampire, you're stealing a part of people's bodies without their permission, every single
| |
| night. You're eventually going to kill one of them when you get a little too hungry one
| |
| night.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">And do you know why Vampire is the superior game by far? Because
| |
| the game forces you to find out what you'll do to survive. If you have to drink somebody
| |
| else's blood in order to live another night, will you do it? Will you drain some bum on
| |
| the street, or stalk somebody for three hours and take only a taste? Or will you subsist
| |
| on dogs and cats? Every time you stab somebody in the throat with your fangs, drink the
| |
| blood - even if you're not thinking about it in the game - you're essentially risking
| |
| somebody else's life for your own. You can say that you're a vampire, you have to do that,
| |
| but nothing's stopping you from seeing the next sunrise except your own sense of
| |
| self-preservation, even when you're already dead. Yes, you are playing a vampire in an
| |
| RPG, but you can still kill yourself in the game and make it a valid, in-character choice.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>Vampire sounds pretty limited. I have never played it, but it sounds like a game that
| |
| focuses on one race or 'occupation', in FATAL terms: a Vampire. If this is true, FATAL
| |
| offers either ten or a hundred times more role-playing possibilities, respectively. If I'm
| |
| wrong about Vampire, then my apologies to the game designers. The point of an RPG should
| |
| be to allow a gamer to play the role of anyone they desire. FATAL delivers.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I would like to reiterate what Byron said earlier about
| |
| FATAL. I doubt anywhere in Vampire does the vampire date the victim. So Darren don’t
| |
| sugarcoat it. Vampire could be described as a rape game. The low level of maturity when
| |
| dealing with controversial subjects blows my mind. Anyway, I don’t really see the
| |
| difference between playing a vampire and being that unlucky gamer who rolls a random
| |
| mental illness and ends up with raptophilia. Either way you’re almost forced to take
| |
| another human being by force and get what you need from them. But there is the option to
| |
| kill yourself instead. </font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Hate to cut into Darren's pathos, but the thing I remember most
| |
| from Vampire was how you can chainsaw whack someone with 8 successes and still barely hurt
| |
| them. Fucking dice pools. (Oh, hush.) </font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in">The
| |
| odds in FATAL are that if you attack a character with a weapon, then they are likely to
| |
| die. By the way, this is an obvious attempt at realism.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">But yes, sadly, even
| |
| in this area, Vampire is way superior to FATAL.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Why does Jason never support his claim with
| |
| evidence? In the area of attacks and the likelihood of fatality, I challenge Jason to
| |
| support his claim.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I find it mockingly hilarious how Sartin says that
| |
| hitting someone with a chainsaw 8 times and having them live is better than FATAL. While
| |
| in FATAL most likely you’ll have trouble getting up from a footman’s flail shot.
| |
| Even better eight shots. HA</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">It's in the background, but it's there. You have to make a
| |
| decision. In Vampire, it's an adult decision: Do I kill to live? In FATAL, it's "Date
| |
| rape and killing and cadavers are all cool! YEEEEEEAH! THANK YOU FOR SHOWING ME THE WAY,
| |
| SPRAY PAINT HUFFING AND SOCIAL RETARDATION!"</font></p>
| |
| <p>It's boring to continue to correct Darren for failing to represent FATAL. In FATAL, you
| |
| may have to make complicated socio-political decisions as a lord or lady, king or queen.
| |
| Did he see that in the game? Has he actually read it?</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Maybe there's some subculture that's into this; judging from the
| |
| FATAL theme song, which sounds like the Cookie Monster chasing a drum kit being pushed
| |
| down a flight of stairs, I'd guess thrash metal or speed metal or metal metal or whatever
| |
| the fuck they call it nowadays.</font></p>
| |
| <p>The Cookie Monster is cool! They call that death metal.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: From what I know about the FATAL theme, it was done very
| |
| quickly and probably should be redone in a better studio version. But I definitely agree
| |
| that death metal is some of the best music out nowadays.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Incidentally, the [http://www.hyperbooks.com/fatal/fatal.theme.sample.mp3 FATAL theme] sucked
| |
| enough to make Darren beg me to kill him. If for some reason you aren't interested in
| |
| suicide, I would recommend not listening to it. Hell, I would recommend not paying
| |
| attention to FATAL at all, but here you still are. You've got problems, people.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in">So, Jason's best means of recommending that people pay no attention to something is to do a
| |
| lengthy, emotional review, in which conclusions are the result of flawed reason? If so,
| |
| then I have never seen this approach before.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I have only one question. Why didn’t you do it
| |
| Sartin? </font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">See, even the most extreme of this stuff - say, [http://www.cannibalcorpse.net/ Cannibal Corpse] - is designed to take a stage
| |
| persona, say "Screw you, world!" for a few hours, then being regular people
| |
| again; it's born out of showmanship, like an extreme form of professional wrestling sans
| |
| the body slams. FATAL isn't a piece of showmanship; it's one of the diaries from Se7en, a
| |
| document pretending that it's perfectly normal and healthy and winds up painting its
| |
| authors as terribly, terribly maladjusted.</font></p>
| |
| <p>..."terribly, terribly"... There Darreb goes again with redundancy. FATAL is
| |
| not a piece of showmanship. It is a comprehensive game, true to its premises. By the way,
| |
| I think Cannibal Corpse is awesome musically, lyrically, and athletically.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: The only game issues that have brought up to this point
| |
| are that the game is “mysogonistic, homophobic, and racist”. Not to say that it
| |
| is, because there are gays in the game. Along with equal degradation of males and females,
| |
| and equal degradation of races. But, to say that none of those existed in the time period
| |
| covered by FATAL, is rather maladjusted. Beyond that if you’re looking for the most
| |
| extreme of stuff I recommend looking a band called Anal Blast. Much more extreme, in my
| |
| view, than Cannibal Corpse.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: During the FATAL flame wars, Hall really did have that
| |
| psychotically calm John Doe demeanor in his posts. It might actually have been impressive,
| |
| but any chance for that went out the window when he never defended any of his bullshit
| |
| arguments or claims when MacLennan, Patrick Chipman, and everyone else started questioning
| |
| him. Well, and when I couldn't help picturing him in a lavender bunny suit as he typed.
| |
| (Okay, no, that's not originally what I was picturing him doing, but it's a
| |
| sanity-preserving substitute.)</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>In debates, I always remain calm and unemotional. Actually, every post is available to
| |
| anyone who desires to view them at RPGnet. Since this is verifiable, Jason either lies, or
| |
| simply doesn't know any better. I attempted to defend my claims when questioned. However,
| |
| there was hardly any questioning, and most posts resemble the level presented by Darren
| |
| and Jason in this review. When I realised, by and large, RPGnetters were aversive to
| |
| reason and driven by emotion, I stopped posting. When Darren MacLennan chose libel and
| |
| defamation of character to debate, I stopped posting. So far, my credibility must seem
| |
| immeasurably beyond that of Darren and Jason. I am credible because I am honest,
| |
| professional, and a scholar. Nothing seems to drive these two crazier. I will always be
| |
| open to debating FATAL.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p><font color="#009900">And I am now on the second page.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">If you want another good example of how the game's authors seem
| |
| desperate to lie to themselves, and by extension the reader, you can check out their
| |
| claims that they're not really sexually deviant; they're just including it for the purpose
| |
| of completeness. For example:</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p><font color="#009900">The information in this game does not represent the world-views
| |
| of Fatal Games, nor is extreme violence or extreme sex condoned by Fatal Games. Instead,
| |
| the information is included for completeness.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Although you should have put quotes on my words above, let it be known I still stand by
| |
| them.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">And this weak bullshit might fly, if it weren't for the fact that
| |
| they were openly drooling over the possibility of people extorting sexual favors and/or
| |
| raping a helpless woman ''not one page before.''</font></p>
| |
| <p>It's tiring to reiterate, but I covered numerous possibilities in the example Darren
| |
| cited (by the way, I thank him for citing an example). However, he selected one
| |
| possibility at the expense of the others. Darren faiedl to represent FATAL.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: Along with failing to represent FATAL, Darren also
| |
| doesn’t realize that in more than 95% of games “extorting sexual favors and/or
| |
| raping” is not part of the story. Having been a play-tester for a few years I can say
| |
| this with utmost assurance. </font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: That, and it's a trick statement anyway. Remember that FATALites
| |
| lack the necessary balls to even approach women in real life. Their supposed
| |
| non-endorsement of rape/violence stems from cowardice, not "Hey, it's just a
| |
| game." </font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in">What Jason knows about my personal life, for example, is obviously far less than his
| |
| insinuation. For example, my wife studies bioengineering and used to be a model. I don't
| |
| think much of most college curriculums, but if my claims are true, then she is at least
| |
| reasonably intelligent and attractive. To my delight, I would argue that she is an
| |
| advanced scholar (knowing many stupid scholars, I mean a smart one), and exceedingly
| |
| beautiful. We are identical in age, and born only one week apart. She is everything to me,
| |
| and yes, she is a woman. Jason's arguments provide no substance or challenge.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I would say that goes for all Fatalists that I know as
| |
| well. That what he knows is far less than his insinuation. I refuse to get into my
| |
| personal life but I’ll just say there is no “lack of necessary balls” or
| |
| “cowardice”. That being said there is also no lack of opposite gender choice for
| |
| me. I like to have options.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">But hey. If you don't
| |
| want to play dirty by personally attacking the FATALites, just consider this: "Okay,
| |
| they don't condone rape, misogyny, and five hundred foot nutsacks...they're just really
| |
| proud that the overwhelming focus FATAL puts on rape, misogyny, and five hundred foot
| |
| nutsacks makes it SO much more 'realistic' and 'historically/mythically accurate' than
| |
| every other RPG available!"</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>If the reader considers Jason's claim, then the reader should be compelled to measure
| |
| the degree of focus on rape, for instance. This is necessary, because Jason does not do it
| |
| himself, to support his claim. There is only a focus on rape on 2 pages out of 900. Since
| |
| page numbers vary as material is added or the game is edited, I will direct your attention
| |
| to the Wrestling skill in Chapter 8: Skills. Specifically, please read the last two
| |
| paragraphs of Overbearing. Note that the female has a chance to injure the would-be
| |
| rapist. This section on rape is intended to present it realistically, not from a biased
| |
| perspective of a rapist. Elsewhere in Chap. 6: Sociality, _Medieval Prostitution_ is cited
| |
| for the information on rape in societal terms. Aside from these, there are spells
| |
| involving rape. I have not counted them or their total length in numbers of pages, and do
| |
| not consider it necessary. Please note that they are referenced from Greek Magical Papyri,
| |
| and are accurate to the translated scrolls. To make this clear, spells from Greek scrolls
| |
| have italicized titles, while spells invented by myself and others have non-italicized
| |
| titles. I have not counted spells involving rape that are either Greek or invented, but
| |
| doubt that invented spells are disproportionate in number. In short, if a reader compares
| |
| the amount of material involving rape in FATAL with material that does not, the reader
| |
| will find it to be a very small portion, and not out of line with history.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p>There are no instances of misogyny (woman-hating) in FATAL that outnumber instances of
| |
| man-hating (for lack of a better term). Either rarely occurs, but only misogyny is cited
| |
| by Darren and Jason.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p>As far as I know, the gigantic and magically altered scrotum is only a single instance
| |
| in Appendix 3: Random Magical Effects, of which there are 2,000. Most of the random
| |
| magical effects are intended as humorous, since they may include anything. However, if
| |
| anyone finds a historically accurate list of random magical effects, please contact Fatal
| |
| Games, and expect to see them included, as would be true to the premises of the game.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Doesn't really work,
| |
| does it?</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Your approach? No, it doesn't.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Or, even better:</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p><font color="#009900">For instance, the detail of violence may exceed that of other
| |
| role-playing games, as crucial damage may explicitly explore the destruction of many body
| |
| parts and internal organs.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Except that what the guys at FATAL know about medical science
| |
| and/or the human body is so small as to actually suck away from the collected body of
| |
| medical knowledge; as a matter of fact, there are entire anatomy texts that are now blank
| |
| because the knowledge has been drained away to fill the terrible wound that FATAL made.</font></p>
| |
| <p>While I am not a medical doctor, I think the reader will find that my anatomy is better
| |
| than the arguments of Darren and Jason.</p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Those of you who are upset that Hall took a giant piss on
| |
| anatomical science can take heart in knowing that he also soaked everything that's ever
| |
| been written about art, medieval history, and RPG design while he was at it. </font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Meanwhile,
| |
| Testosticles forbid that just fucking describing an injury isn't any better than FATAL's
| |
| lame ass "Crucial Damage" charts. I mean, really:</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">02% Belly Button </font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.5in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">Opponent’s belly is hacked, though no critical organs behind it. The
| |
| small intestine may (70%) spill forth. If it does, the sight of this causes the opponent
| |
| to need to pass a Health check at TH 50 or be stunned for 2d4 rounds.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Yeah, having your
| |
| small intestine spill forth sure can be distracting! (And yes, any "It's just a flesh
| |
| wound!" jokes you want to make here are entirely appropriate. It's not a
| |
| life-threatening critical.)</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>Although Jason meant crucial, not critical, he failed to account for the damage.
| |
| Because of damage, which is handled prior to the chart he referenced, all Crucial Damage
| |
| is life-threatening. In fact, if he paid attention, nearly all weapon-based attacks are
| |
| life-threatening in FATAL. However, a belly button is listed as less crucial regarding
| |
| hacking a torso than, say, hacking a lumbar vertebrae. Again, Jason failed to represent
| |
| FATAL.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">
| |
| <font color="#FF00FF">Further, role-playing situations that accurately represent
| |
| mythology are likely at some point to include rape, molestation, encounters in brothels or
| |
| possibly situations that deviate more from social norms.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Enjoy this first mention of "Well, because it's historical,
| |
| we're not in trouble." As much in life, the authors of FATAL use history and
| |
| mythology as they use any other source: Go through it for the dirty parts, ignore
| |
| everything else, then claim that you're entirely accurate. (And while there are myths that
| |
| deal with rape - most of them Greek - molestation, brothel visits, or giving birth to a
| |
| clone through your cock didn't appear in any of them. Nice try, though.)</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>Although Darren erroneously presumed to know anything about my life, he failed to
| |
| support any argument about skipping solid content and only including dirty parts. By the
| |
| way, Darren should learn that brothels existed long before, and after, Ancient Greece. In
| |
| fact, brothels were the accepted norm throughout the Middle Ages. As a reference, I cited
| |
| _Medieval Prostitution_. There is nothing dirty about notes on Roads, Mail, and Around
| |
| Town, which are sections in Chapter 6: Sociality. Of course, I can cite numerous other
| |
| examples, but Darren does not appear to support his claims, or if he does, it is with
| |
| minimum effort. Finally, random magical effects have already been discussed. If a
| |
| historical source exists, please let me know.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I have to jump in here just to state how hypocritical
| |
| Darren is. He accuses FATAL of only taking the dirty parts of historical texts. But does
| |
| this himself when doing a review of FATAL. </font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: This would be a good place to rag on the "one thousand hours
| |
| of research" the FATALites are ever so quick to bleat that Hall did when he shat out
| |
| FATAL. While many of you have been understandably skeptical of this figure, I can easily
| |
| see it. In fact, going from FATAL's end product, Hall's research probably went something
| |
| like: </font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">20 hours: Playing AD&D and thinking "I could so do better than
| |
| this."</font></p>
| |
| | |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">20
| |
| years, actually.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font
| |
| color="#808080">Burnout: 12 years here.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font
| |
| color="#FF00FF">
| |
| 0.4 hours: Hitting head on a toilet and becoming absolutely sure of that.<br>
| |
| 2 hours: Being rejected by fuckable women. (If you're willing to expand the definition of
| |
| "fuckable" to include the words "within four drinks", then the final
| |
| research total can be considered well over 1,000 hours.)</font></p>
| |
| | |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">Judging by the level of Jason's criticism alone, I can't help but think that Jason would surely
| |
| fail a comparison between my sex life and his. Why are we even talking about sex life?</p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#808080">Burnout: I’m just wondering. As much as Sartin’s criticisms are
| |
| based on the Fatalists having cowardice to approach women or being rejected by them. I
| |
| wonder if this is projection.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">25 hours: Huffing paint and listening to death metal.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">I never have "huffed" paint, but I've definitely listened to death metal,
| |
| classical, and neoclassical (and nothing else) for over a decade.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">
| |
| 0.2 hours: Composing the FATAL theme while still disoriented from the paint huffing.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">It's a moot point, but I don't consider the FATAL theme to be an outstanding musical work. It
| |
| was not written with that intention. Instead, it was written with a commerical intent,
| |
| which automatically sacrifices musicality. Just the same, it serves its purpose well,
| |
| until something better comes along.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">
| |
| 20 hours: Thumbing through every medieval history book that has the word
| |
| "prostitute".</font></p>
| |
| | |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">Does anyone know of any others that are written by respectable scholars?</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">
| |
| 5 hours: Accidentally flipping through Roman or Biblical history books and either a)
| |
| mistaking them for medieval history books, or b) failing to realize that, as human society
| |
| varied drastically over the course of history, writing FATAL in a way that portrays
| |
| society being pretty much the same EVERYWHERE, ALL THE TIME and calling it
| |
| "historically accurate" is a bad move.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">I hope it is understood from earlier that the first fallacy made by Jason above is that in
| |
| many instances, ancient literature had to be consulted to fill-in for medieval literature
| |
| to be true to the premises of the game. For example, some argue that slaves did not exist
| |
| in medieval Europe. However, if they considered that I have attempted to extract
| |
| Christianity due to polytheism, then the prevalent slavery during the days of Rome is
| |
| appropriate.</p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">The second fallacy is that FATAL does not portray society the same "EVERYWHERE, ALL THE
| |
| TIME". What Jason fails to understand is that there are 2 books to FATAL. The
| |
| first, the one he pretends to have reviewed, is the system itself. The 2nd book, entitled
| |
| Neveria so far, will detail FATAL's gaming world, monsters, and gods. As the most detailed
| |
| gaming world ever, you can expect cultural and temporal variance. To Jason's credit, on
| |
| this last point, how could he have known better?</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">
| |
| 0.4 hours: Mistaking a policewoman for a prostitute.<br>
| |
| 10 hours: Flipping through anatomy and medical texts while drunk. "Yeah, I think you
| |
| could make a Health check to survive if your sternum was driven into your heart. Way
| |
| cool."</font></p>
| |
| | |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">Actually, I don't get drunk (though I will have a few here and there). I am not a drinker, just so
| |
| you know.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">
| |
| 2 hours: Repairing punctures in "Sexpot Annie".</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">Projecting?</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">
| |
| 5 hours: Flipping through kids' mythology books and watching Hercules: the Legendary
| |
| Journeys, and realizing (with the help of a large, skull-shaped bong) that Zeus and Odin
| |
| must have been total ass-bandits and they just left that part out, and
| |
| "mythological" just means whatever the fuck you want to make up.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">But, I never inhaled! Actually, I've probably only seen one or two episodes of Hercules. I
| |
| praise Bruce Campbell, but think the rest of it should rot.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I have actually seen about 10 or 15 episodes of
| |
| Hercules. For about 2 weeks I thought they were hilarious. The absolutely sad fight scenes
| |
| were funny until I realized they were trying to be serious. But none of my mythological
| |
| knowledge came from that sorry show.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in"><font color="#FF00FF">10 hours: Reading up on non-cognitivism, ether theory, and physiognomy
| |
| without realizing that they're not exactly respected ideas anymore.<br>
| |
| 900 hours: Circle jerking with Torturon, Burnout, and Psychotic Messanger (sic) of Death.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:1.0in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
| |
| mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in">Although
| |
| I included basic physiognomy and the concept of ether in FATAL, I have never respected
| |
| either (obviously). Just another instance of things I put in the game that I disagree
| |
| with, but see them as appropriate to FATAL. I wonder how much Jason knows about
| |
| noncognitivism.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I actually to a degree respect the idea of
| |
| noncognitivism. I know most people don’t but it’s a matter of opinion, I guess.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">I can't verify any of
| |
| this, of course, but it's the combination of events that would most plausibly result in
| |
| FATAL.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">By now, everyone who has read this should be
| |
| used to the fact that Jason supports or verifies little to nothing.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">By the way, did I mention that this book is 900 pages long?</font></p>
| |
| <p>Redundancy.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">'Cause I'm going to be bringing it up as this review progresses.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Great.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">A lot.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Wonderful.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Because you bastards owe me.</font></p>
| |
| <p>Great attitude.</p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Yeah, what he said. I never thought I'd see actually wanting to
| |
| play Imagine or Palladium, but now that I've gone through FATAL, damned if I can even
| |
| remember what sucked so much about them. </font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Ugh. Fuck
| |
| "owing", gentle readers. I'm coming for your young.</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: Hmmm.. Short term memory loss. Are we so sure it’s
| |
| not Sartin who has the “large, skull shaped bong."</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">What makes FATAL especially fun is the droning, obsessive tone of
| |
| its rules sections - for example:</font></p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">Finally, observe that when these sub-abilities and abilities are
| |
| determined initially for a character, the abilities are determined for young adults. After
| |
| the sub-abilities are described and the tables presented, aging effects are illustrated
| |
| which must be referenced throughout the character's life. The last chapter details how two
| |
| abilities, Physical Fitness and Strength, may be increased through persistent exercise,
| |
| and also, an alternate rolling method is presented.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p>Although the current version has not been made available in over a month due to
| |
| numerous little changes, it will be possible (in the same # of pages) to also increase
| |
| Intelligence with use (or its converse). This is cited from _The Executive Brain_ and
| |
| _Owner's Manual for the Brain_. </p>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">And there's that not-English again; where, when you rewrite it
| |
| for a review, you find yourself restructuring the way that you speak English. Sure, you
| |
| may have been able to write and/or speak it before; but then you read something like this,
| |
| and you find yourself taking sentences out into the shed at midnight, butchering them,
| |
| burying parts of them in the backyard and then redistributing what's left over the
| |
| original document as a warning to any other proper use of the language in the book. </font></p>
| |
| <p>That was a lengthy way for Darren to say he dislikes my prose (especially since there's
| |
| little, if anything, grammatically wrong with it, while both Darren and Jason commit split
| |
| infinitives, dangling prepositions, etc. throughout their review).</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I think they just have trouble understanding Byron's
| |
| prose, is all. They actually have to think for a minute and I bet that hurts to know that
| |
| the one who created FATAL has a better understanding of the English language than they do.</font></p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: On the "bright" side, FATAL is arguably not as
| |
| mind-numbingly written as Aria or Multiverser. On the "you haven't been huffing
| |
| butane" side, that's much like saying "Okay, so I slid naked down a giant
| |
| greased razor blade, but at least I'm not the guy who was thrown into a vat of fire
| |
| ants." </font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">In both cases, either
| |
| outcome is totally stupid and painful, and the party responsible should be gang-beaten
| |
| with cattle prods until the God of Bitch-Slapping finally comes down and says
| |
| "Alright, I think he's had enough..." Except that in the most obnoxious case of
| |
| all these, the God would suddenly add "Oh, wait, this was for writing FATAL, wasn't
| |
| it? Here, let me recharge those for you."</font></p>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Yes, I'm actually
| |
| saying that writing FATAL is more worthy of a cattle prod beating than throwing someone
| |
| into a vat of fire ants.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">Although you are entitled to your opinion,
| |
| you have been unable to support it.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#009900">See, try this:</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p><font color="#009900">These abilities only represent your character at the start of his
| |
| life, so they will change as he ages; charts for this are elsewhere. Later on, we'll
| |
| detail how you can increase your Strength and Physical Fitness, as well as an alternate
| |
| method of rolling dice. Also, since you're reading FATAL, you should probably be aware
| |
| that this game sucks.</font></p>
| |
| <p>I'm sure it's obvious, but just to be safe, I never wrote a single sentence above.</p>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: I think it’s quite obvious given the fact Darren
| |
| states “These abilities only represent your character at the start of his life”.
| |
| I could just imagine that. “This is one strong baby you’ve got here miss.”
| |
| Also the fact he doesn’t state where the charts and details are for increasing
| |
| sub-abilities are at. Now I don’t claim to have the greatest grasp of the English
| |
| language, as far as grammar, but Byron’s writing, to me, is far easier to reference.</font></p>
| |
| | |
| <p><font color="#009900">See? English. No [http://www.disinfo.com/pages/dossier/id94/pg1/ Grant Morrison-esque] portals
| |
| opened up into a not-world in which the English language was thrown down, danced upon and
| |
| then sodomized. Not yet, at least.</font></p>
| |
| <p>I wonder if Darren is aware that his English, at least as presented here, is worse than
| |
| that in FATAL.</p>
| |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Sartin: Needless to say, there aren't any editors, copyeditors,
| |
| proofreaders, or non-retards in FATAL's credits. I'm not convinced there are any human
| |
| beings, either, but we won't get into that. </font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-right:.5in;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
| |
| auto;margin-left:.5in">As stated before, credits are not listed...yet.</p>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p><font color="#808080">Burnout: Obviously not, as Sartin stated before we are demigods.</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <blockquote>
| |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in"><font color="#FF00FF">Instead, I'd rather
| |
| take this moment to rant that this is a great example of why editors are really damned
| |
| important if you're writing a RPG. They're not just good for correcting typos, but making
| |
| sure your writing technique does not end up sucking all that is ass. If you're not the
| |
| best writer in the history of the universe, don't end up like FATAL! Get those editors!</font></p>
| |
| </blockquote>
| |
| | |
| <p style="margin-right:.5in;margin-left:.5in">I'm sure the reader noticed that again,
| |
| Jason did not support his claim that English is problematic in FATAL. How many times does
| |
| this need to be said? Somebody, please count.</p>
| |
| ----
| |
| [[FRRPart2|Go to part 2]]
| |